Bart Ehrman Blog Readers Forum

A A A
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Min search length: 3 characters / Max search length: 84 characters
Lost password?
sp_TopicIcon
Astounding Victory over the Forces of Evil
Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
1
July 27, 2022 - 10:40 pm

** you do not have permission to see this link ** is the Sauron of scholarly Biblical Studies.  A prestigious publisher, founded in 1623 in Leiden (The Netherlands), Brill has offices all over the world.   Brill is enormously successful.  But when I search for important texts on subjects of interest, and I find out the work is published by Brill my blood runs cold and I succumb to a kind of despair.

Why? 

All scholarly publications are expensive.  They have a limited audience.  Most volumes are headed for libraries.  It is not unusual for a clothbound book on a scholarly subject to list at anywhere from $75 to $125.    A paper version, if it exists, will list at $40 to $60.  I understand the reality of things.  A non-specialist interested in a subject past the surface introductory level simply cannot be a high priority for academic publishers.  Nevertheless, with a certain patience, it’s possible to find used copies of many of these publications at acceptable prices.  (And believe it or not there are even ** you do not have permission to see this link **.)

So, what’s the problem?

Brill never has sales.  Or discounts.  And they hardly know what a paperback is.  Their clothbound volumes routinely sell for more than $200.  They simply have no concept of the “interested non-specialist”.   (If you go on their site and glance at their book list you will see at least one PDF version of a book that sells for $300!  A PDF! $300!  Contact that.  Identify with that.)   This is why when I want a book and it has the Brill imprint, I take long gloomy walks in the moonlight. 

I congratulate Brill on their willingness to support study in many arcane and obscure fields but why go to all the trouble to enable these studies only to stumble on the very particular that determines most how widely the information is made available – the price? 

Consider

** you do not have permission to see this link **

(I include the link for your amusement not to suggest you ever buy this sort of thing from Amazon.)

Merkavah mysticism is a school of early Jewish mysticism, c. 100? BCE – 1000? CE, that took as its inspiration Ezekiel’s awesome vision of Yahweh’s divine chariot. The Hekhalot literature is the corpus of texts generated by this movement which incorporated imagery and ideas from the Enoch literature and Gnosticism.  The Talmud cautions about its study.  There are references in the Dead Sea Scrolls material.    The much later and much more famous Kabballah drew much from Merkavah.  Maimonides’ influential work ** you do not have permission to see this link ** is in large part a response to the Merkavah tradition.   

Merkavah has astonishing parallels to early Christianity, so much so that Paul has been described as a model Merkavah mystic. The difference with Christianity is that these particular Jewish apocalyptic sectarians remained strictly Torah observant. 

Imagine if every time you wanted to read the ** you do not have permission to see this link ** material you had to do an Interlibrary Loan or spend $200?  Some texts are so central to the study that if you’re truly interested you need to have a copy in front of you.  James Davila’s book is the current go-to collection and commentary on this material.  

Brill Publishing is the Sauron of scholarly Biblical Studies. 

Yet even in this Dark Hour the Noble Seeker after Truth, pure in heart, who considers the request to pay full price for anything an insult – and a challenge – may emerge from Mordor in possession of all his fingers.   

I have acquired My Precious.  And through precious little effort of my own.  My beautiful friend Galadriel* who works at the Temple of Divine Light, namely ** you do not have permission to see this link **, small local chain of used bookstores here in the DC area, made it possible. Knowing my interest she graciously held the volume for me.  I received not only the regular used book discount but also the 50% discount available at the Wheaton Warehouse location.  (Lest you think I got away with something she informed me that if I hadn’t snapped it up this book would have probably sat on the shelf unloved for years.  Not a big bestseller folks.  Or even rare.  Just ridiculously overpriced.)   G- is hereby and henceforth in perpetuity declared Queen of Heaven, with all the rights and privileges associated with such an awesome designation. 

* Name changed of course to protect her privacy.  The joke is that G- loathes LOTR and fantasy literature and wouldn’t get any of the references in this here post. 

Avatar
Judith

878 Posts
(Online)
2
July 27, 2022 - 10:52 pm

Nothing like getting something we want! Congratulations, Stephen.

Avatar
CEJ

361 Posts
(Offline)
3
July 28, 2022 - 11:42 am

Judith said
Nothing like getting something we want! Congratulations, Stephen.

  

I wanted to win the Mega Millions jackpot.

That didn’t happen.

I didn’t wanna win for me; I just wanted to ensure this piece of real estate got a good caretaker:

** you do not have permission to see this link **

I’m good that way, ya know.

Avatar
Judith

878 Posts
(Online)
4
July 28, 2022 - 11:49 am

WOW!!!

Avatar
CEJ

361 Posts
(Offline)
5
July 28, 2022 - 11:56 am

Judith said
WOW!!!

  

I know.

My selflessness has no bounds, huh?

Avatar
JAS

948 Posts
(Offline)
6
July 28, 2022 - 12:03 pm

If it makes you feel any better, CEJ, my understanding is that the termites in Hawaii are a constant and serious problem.

I often note that there seems to be something about having a billion dollars that makes people go crazy. I would like to personally test the theory, but have not found anyone to fund the experiment.

Avatar
CEJ

361 Posts
(Offline)
7
July 28, 2022 - 1:33 pm

JAS said
If it makes you feel any better, CEJ, my understanding is that the termites in Hawaii are a constant and serious problem.

I did not know that.

Avatar
Adnantell

24 Posts
(Offline)
8
July 29, 2022 - 12:24 am

Libgen is a great resource for the free book

Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
9
July 29, 2022 - 8:37 pm

Adnantell said
Libgen is a great resource for the free book

  

Caveat Emptor

Further deponent sayeth naught. 

Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
10
July 29, 2022 - 8:45 pm

Y’all* get off my LZ! 

Or stay. 

But it’s about to get weird. 

Don’t say you weren’t warned.

 

* Y’all is my solution to the transgender/non-binary pronoun crisis. Just make Y’all singular as well as plural.  Just call everybody y’all.  It’s not rocket science folks.  Just requires a modicum of good will.

Avatar
2380

61 Posts
(Offline)
11
July 31, 2022 - 8:31 am

Don’t forget the plural… All yall!

Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
12
August 1, 2022 - 9:41 pm

THOSE WHO WOULD ENTER THE GARDEN AND GLIMPSE THE THRONE TAKE HEED OF THE FATE OF THOSE WHO WENT BEFORE YOU

 

*pardes, “orchard

** Elisha ben Avuya, whose name is occluded because of his fate

***Yeah we’ll get to that

****lost his mind

*****became a heretic

Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
13
August 1, 2022 - 9:55 pm

The Vision of the Chariot

 

In the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, on the fifth day of the month, as I was among the exiles by the River Chebar, the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God. On the fifth day of the month (it was the fifth year of the exile of King Jehoiachin), the word of the Lord came to the priest Ezekiel son of Buzi in the land of the Chaldeans by the River Chebar, and the hand of the Lord was on him there.

As I looked, a stormy wind came out of the north: a great cloud with brightness around it and fire flashing forth continually and in the middle of the fire something like gleaming amber.  In the middle of it was something like four living creatures. This was their appearance: they were of human form.  Each had four faces, and each of them had four wings. Their legs were straight, and the soles of their feet were like the sole of a calf’s foot, and they sparkled like burnished bronze.  Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. And the four had their faces and their wings thus:  their wings touched one another; each of them moved straight ahead, without turning as they moved.

As for the appearance of their faces: the four had the face of a human being, the face of a lion on the right side, the face of an ox on the left side, and the face of an eagle; such were their faces. Their wings were spread out above; each creature had two wings, each of which touched the wing of another, while two covered their bodies. Each moved straight ahead; wherever the spirit would go, they went, without turning as they went. In the middle of the living creatures there was something that looked like burning coals of fire, like torches moving to and fro among the living creatures; the fire was bright, and lightning issued from the fire. The living creatures darted to and fro, like a flash of lightning.

As I looked at the living creatures, I saw a wheel on the earth beside the living creatures, one for each of the four of them. As for the appearance of the wheels and their construction: their appearance was like the gleaming of beryl, and the four had the same form, their construction being something like a wheel within a wheel. When they moved, they moved in any of the four directions without veering as they moved. Their rims were tall and awesome, for the rims of all four were full of eyes all around. When the living creatures moved, the wheels moved beside them, and when the living creatures rose from the earth, the wheels rose. Wherever the spirit would go, they went, and the wheels rose along with them, for a living spirit was in the wheels. When they moved, the others moved; when they stopped, the others stopped; and when they rose from the earth, the wheels rose along with them, for a living spirit was in the wheels.

Over the heads of the living creatures there was something like a dome, shining like crystal, spread out above their heads. Under the dome their wings were stretched out straight, one toward another, and each of the creatures had two wings covering its body. When they moved, I heard the sound of their wings like the sound of mighty waters, like the thunder of the Almighty, a sound of tumult like the sound of an army; when they stopped, they let down their wings. And there came a voice from above the dome over their heads; when they stopped, they let down their wings.

And above the dome over their heads there was something like a throne, in appearance like sapphire, and seated above the likeness of the throne was something that seemed like a human form. Upward from what appeared like the loins I saw something like gleaming amber, something that looked like fire enclosed all around, and downward from what looked like the loins I saw something that looked like fire, and there was a splendor all around. Like the bow in a cloud on a rainy day, such was the appearance of the splendor all around. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord.

When I saw it, I fell on my face, and I heard the voice of someone speaking.

(NRSV)

Avatar
Robert
7123 Posts
(Offline)
14
August 1, 2022 - 10:43 pm
Avatar
2380

61 Posts
(Offline)
15
August 2, 2022 - 7:55 am

Robert, I didn’t know that, but where’s the good will?

Avatar
Robert
7123 Posts
(Offline)
16
August 2, 2022 - 8:35 am
Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
17
August 2, 2022 - 10:04 am

How can I possibly respond without seeming vainglorious?  Just don’t mistake those marble stones for water. 

Avatar
JAS

948 Posts
(Offline)
18
August 2, 2022 - 10:12 am

Given the South’s traditional and enduring stance on almost any form of tolerance, I would expect a good deal of enthusiastic pushback on trying to thus assign their much cherished “ya’all”

Avatar
Judith

878 Posts
(Online)
19
August 2, 2022 - 10:26 am

When Professor Ehrman used y’all in a post, I was quick to let him know we were going to claim him as one of our very own! 

Avatar
Stephen
4606 Posts
(Offline)
20
August 3, 2022 - 11:00 pm

In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord* sitting on a throne, high and lofty, and the hem of his robe filled the temple. Seraphs** were in attendance above him; each had six wings: with two they covered their faces, and with two they covered their feet***, and with two they flew. And one called to another and said,

“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of hosts;
the whole earth is full of his glory.”

The pivots on the thresholds shook at the voices of those who called, and the house filled with smokeAnd I said, “Woe is me! I am lost, for I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, yet my eyes have seen the King*, the Lord of hosts!”

 

* Directly contradicting John 1:18 and 1 John 4:12

** burning, frequently translated as ‘serpent’ in the OT.  The association is not completely clear.  Robert Alter suggests we should visualize a fiery serpent with wings, but see below 

*** Many have considered such OT references to “feet” as euphemisms for the male genitals.  

Forum Timezone: America/Indiana/Indianapolis
All RSSShow Stats
Administrators:
BDEhrman
FreedomBen
evgendob
Robert
Top Posters:
Steefen: 7791
Stephen: 4606
Porphyry: 1852
godspell: 1827
DavidFord: 1430
BJH1960: 1208
brenmcg: 1184
Colin Milton: 1142
JAS: 948
Jarek: 936
Newest Members:
iamevenbao
admin
SRB
Auntiejack56
giventerry
brokinrhythm
Thurly
dsorrent7
iam.vernon.b.rose
israelam
Forum Stats:
Groups: 2
Forums: 13
Topics: 2617
Posts: 46495

 

Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 65
Members: 65926
Moderators: 0
Admins: 4
Most Users Ever Online: 3559
Currently Online: Judith, 1stadam1stantiochian
Guest(s) 26