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No, I do not think the ancient Jewish perception of Rome is the one to adopt. Mary Beard's Ultimate Rome
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Steefen
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April 7, 2023 - 3:58 pm

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Steefen
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April 7, 2023 - 4:20 pm

Turn people not born in Rome into Romans — citizenship.
An ingredient of the Roman Empire’s success was citizenship.

Consider Carteia, a settlement in southern Spain (171 BC).
4,000 men, sons of Roman soldiers and Spanish women, were represented by a delegation in Rome.
The improvised solution to these ancient day Ameriasians (tens of thousands of children born to Vietnamese women and American G.I. fathers in the shadows of the Vietnam War) was to give them Carteia as a home and the status: Latins.

= = =

I’m not using the YouTube video but the same episode on Amazon Prime. (For some reason, the YouTube episode 2 is somewhat different from the one I started watching before searching for it on YouTube.)

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Steefen
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April 7, 2023 - 4:24 pm

Apparently, the authors of Jewish Apocalypticism and its prophets, had little education of, appreciation for, and aspiration to Roman status. The Romans had deserved gratitude from other subjects.

p/u @ 4:46

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Steefen
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April 8, 2023 - 3:15 pm

p/u 15:31

Well, Mary Beard is into Roman Algeria and a city originally planned for retired soldiers.

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Steefen
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April 15, 2023 - 12:39 pm

The local rich felt part of something larger.

Some of the local rich in Ancient Israel must have felt the same way–Herod the Great, King Agrippa I, King Agrippa II.

= = =

When looking at this documentary, what a trip Mary Beard went on and the landscapes she has seen.

But no, unlike the King of the Jews, Herod the Great, Jewish Rebels, the bandits of empire would not cooperate, they would be crucified, many defeated in battle.

pick up at 31:23

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Steefen
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April 16, 2023 - 10:29 am

Great. Found something.

Boudicca, also spelled Boadicea or Boudica, (died 60 or 61 ce), ancient British queen

who in 60 ce led a revolt against Roman rule.

Boudicca’s husband, Prasutagus, was king of the Iceni (in what is now Norfolk) as a client under Roman suzerainty.

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Steefen
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April 16, 2023 - 10:44 am

Mary Beard is amazing.

I have to get back to the end of the episode where she is in Aphrodisias.
She has just spoken about an amphitheater that was dual purpose for Greek naked athletics AND Roman gladiator and wild beast hunts.
Now, she is explaining how also, in that ancient city, there was a temple for the imperial cult and she is explaining how that religion differed from the religion of the gods.

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Steefen
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April 16, 2023 - 10:53 am

30 million free people became Roman citizens under Caracalla (188 – 217)

At the outset of his reign, Caracalla declared imperial support for Serapis, the god of healing. The Iseum and Serapeum in Alexandria were apparently renovated during Caracalla’s co-rule with his father Septimius Severus. The evidence for this exists in two inscriptions found near the temple that appear to bear their names. Additional archaeological evidence exists for this in the form of two papyri that have been dated to the Severan period and also two statues associated with the temple that have been dated to around 200 AD. Upon Caracalla’s ascension to being sole ruler in 212, the imperial mint began striking coins bearing Serapis’ image. This was a reflection of the god’s central role during Caracalla’s reign. After Geta’s death, the weapon that had killed him was dedicated to Serapis by Caracalla. This was most likely done to cast Serapis into the role of Caracalla’s protector from treachery.[38]

Caracalla also erected a temple on the Quirinal Hill in 212, which he dedicated to Serapis.

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So, Serapis was important to Vespasian (giving sight to the blind and making a lame man walk) and more than 100 years later, Caracalla.

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Well, I will have to watch all of this series, the next and backwards to a prequel (episode 1).

Points to remember:
A few years before the Jewish Revolt against Rome there was a British Revolt against Rome (led by a woman).
So, the Jewish rebel perspective on the Roman Empire is joined by a rebel perspective on Rome in London.

Serapis was more important to Rome (Vespasian and Caracalla) than the local god of Jewish Apocalpticism who had his Temple destroyed.

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Steefen
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April 16, 2023 - 5:32 pm

Thoughts on Episode 1

Israel stopped at Israel.
Rome conquered Italy and Carthage.
Could Israel conquer Italy and Carthage?
No.

Rome conquered Italy, Carthage, Greece, and Egypt.
Could Israel conquer Italy, Carthage, Greece, Vercingetorix (Gaul), and Egypt?
(And Rome respected Greece’s contribution to civilization.)

No, Israel was back at paying respect to Ancient Egypt during the 18th Dynasty (see the Amarna Letters).

Second, could Israel compete with Roman engineering? No.

Was Ancient Rome taken into exile and needed rationalization, religious Apocalypticism?
No.

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Corinth was the richest city in Greece for a period of time.

The Corinthians were also known for their wealth due to their strategic location on the isthmus, through which all land traffic had to pass en route to the Peloponnese, including messengers and traders.

And, yes, Rome conquered Corinth.

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Steefen
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April 16, 2023 - 6:24 pm

In the Aeneid, Jupiter gives Rome empire without limit.
In the Torah, the god of the Israelites gives them a short-lived freedom from Ancient Egypt. They were not given Empire.

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The documentary is actually a 4-part series.
The third part is next.

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Very interesting: the biblical Jesus calls the Apocalypse from the perspective of a client kingdom of the Roman Empire, not from the perspective of the Empire.
So, Jesus, view of the world was a local view of the end of the world, not an empire view of the end of the world, so neither can Revelation be at that view height.

The following list does not include the First Jewish-Roman War.

** you do not have permission to see this link **

And that war was not on the scale of Roman Empire vs. Parthian Empire.

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Steefen
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April 23, 2023 - 12:39 pm

203 C.E. – Vibia Perpetua becomes a martyr.

– Episode 3 of Mary Beard’s Ultimate Rome

The act “validates” the faith.

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