Jesus existed before his birth back to the time when Go0d created the heavens that could be seen with the naked eye because that is all author of john could use at that time.– and only in the spectrum of light humans can see with the naked eye.
In the Beginning, God created 200 billion to two trillion galaxies.
I will say Genesis, gospel of John, and letters of Paul would have more cosmological questions and explanations of creation in their writing if they knew there was more than two galaxies in existence.
Bart D.E.
I don’t think John or Paul knew anything about
a solar system
galaxy or
universe
I’d say they give no clear indication of when the pre-existent Christ began to exist
or if they thought he had no beginning but was always with God.
John, though clearly thinks he existed before the creation, since it is through him that all things came into being.
Paul probably similarly.
Dr. Ehrmman,
The author of Gospel of John and Paul as the author of the Pauline letters are not authorities on topic of creation.
The author of Gospel of John and Paul were not disciples of the biblical Jesus while he was alive.
They are not authorities on Jesus and whether or not he ever claimed to be pre-existent.
The author of Gospel of John can use the following for a philosophical basis; but, while the Logos has a basis it is conjecture that Jesus was the Logos.
Heraclitus (Greek philosopher active around 500 BCE) held that all things come to be in accordance with the logos.
The later Stoics (200 B.C.E. with Boethus – 180 C.E. with Marcus Aurelius) understood the Logos as “the account which governs everything.” For Heraclitus, logos provided the link between rational discourse and the world’s rational structure. Logos is that which is between meditation or rational discourse and manifestation; hence
1) meditation or rational discourse > 2) Logos > 3) manifestation
Page 153 of my book: Historical Accuracy by Steve Campbell
Author of Gospel of John and author of the Pauline Letter have absolutely no credibility for telling us how light (stars) was created, when, and whether or not there was a creation-being or a creation-phenomenon that produced stars and the beginning of the universe and whether God the Father and God the Son were somehow part of the Nothingness that was before the Big Bang.
We can see two galaxies, our own and another galaxyy when we look at the night sky with the neked eye.
We can see the haze of another galaxy but not individual stars.
If you’re referring to Andromeda, up until the 20s – the 1920s – it was commonly thought that Andromeda was a nebula inside our own galaxy which was thought to be the whole of the universe. So our understanding that our galaxy was simply one in a universe of hundreds of millions is only about a century old. The ancients thought that earth was the center of the cosmos. They had no concept of a galaxy.
From earth, We can see with the naked eye our own galaxy, the Andromeda galaxy, AND other galaxies.
Chat GPT,
Which galaxies can be seen from earth with the naked eye?
Answer (in addition to the Milky Way and the Andromeda galaxies))
The Andromeda Galaxy is approximately 2.5 million light years away but the Large Magellanic Cloud is closer.
It is 160,000 light years away.
The Small Magellanic Cloud is also closer than the Andromeda galaxy.
It is approximately 200,000 light years away.
These two galaxies are visible to the naked eye from the Southern Hemisphere.
The LMC appears at a patch. The SMC appears as a smaller, fainter cloud than the LMC:
The Triangulum Galaxy, approximately 3 million light years away (so, a larger distance away than the Andromeda galaxy) is barely visible.
* * * *
The SMC is actually two galaxies.
BDEhrman
FreedomBen
evgendob
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