ask21771 said
what are the chances the shroud proves jesus was the son of god
Extremely thin.
Consider that there is nothing tying the shroud to Jesus or the first century. The only reason, it is even remotely relevant, is that it
purports to have the image of a crucified man; thus it HAS to be the image of Jesus. That’s one rather humongous assumption.
Not too sure why it can’t be the image of Yehohanan or any other crucified man. There’s an awful lot of question begging and insinuation going on here. However, even if you could tie this cloth to both the first century and Jesus, then what? What exactly would that mean: We have a seemingly well preserved image of a crucified man. Even if we could argue, based on the artifact, that the man was resurrected, how would that translate to the man was the son of god, etc?
ask21771 said
please answer the question
The question cannot be answered. The radiation theory that was debunked back in 2005, I believe, is once again being considered as probable. But take heart. If they have come up with a theory for The Bermuda Triangle mystery, this may soon be resolved, too!
gavriel said
I think it stands out in terms of motif. It is no less than a imprint of the Son, elsewhere unheard of in history and so has a very strong emotional appeal. Most relics are indirect objects, like splinters of the cross, or nails applied in the crucifixion or more remote things like bone fragments of ancient saints. But then there is the Spear of Destiny from Vienna. Science says it is an early medieval age relic product with a possible ancient iron nail at its core. But because of its almost equally strong emotional appeal it continues to drive forth New Age cranks and conspiracy theorists.
Good point, Gav, but the image is on the sheet and no one, as far as I know, can explain how it got there. That’s why I mentioned craftsmenship.
then there is the Spear of Destiny from Vienna. Science says it is an early medieval age relic product with a possible ancient iron nail at its core. But because of its almost equally strong emotional appeal it continues to drive forth New Age cranks and conspiracy theorists.
How do you think that would fare on ebay?
I once heard of a guy who treated some wood and sold it to a bunch of Noah’s Ark efficianados. Later he told them what he did, but they didn’t care ** you do not have permission to see this link **
TShirts of Turin anyone? They all have the image of a crucified Jesus on them. They are made from an official fauxreplica of the towel covering a crucified mans face
spiker said
gavriel said
I think it stands out in terms of motif. It is no less than a imprint of the Son, elsewhere unheard of in history and so has a very strong emotional appeal. Most relics are indirect objects, like splinters of the cross, or nails applied in the crucifixion or more remote things like bone fragments of ancient saints. But then there is the Spear of Destiny from Vienna. Science says it is an early medieval age relic product with a possible ancient iron nail at its core. But because of its almost equally strong emotional appeal it continues to drive forth New Age cranks and conspiracy theorists.Good point, Gav, but the image is on the sheet and no one, as far as I know, can explain how it got there. That’s why I mentioned craftsmenship.
then there is the Spear of Destiny from Vienna. Science says it is an early medieval age relic product with a possible ancient iron nail at its core. But because of its almost equally strong emotional appeal it continues to drive forth New Age cranks and conspiracy theorists.
How do you think that would fare on ebay?
I once heard of a guy who treated some wood and sold it to a bunch of Noah’s Ark efficianados. Later he told them what he did, but they didn’t care ** you do not have permission to see this link **
TShirts of Turin anyone? They all have the image of a crucified Jesus on them. They are made from an official fauxreplica of the towel covering a crucified mans face. We don’t know how the image got on the Tshirts, but it must be a sign!
ask21771 said
I repeat why wasn’t I told that three of the four canon gospels say that jesus was wrapped in a burial cloth and that only the gospel of john says other wise?!
Who should have told you and why would they? Answers to specific questions can be researched easily enough by googling. Dr. Ehrman will answer any question having to do with the New Testament if it does not involve too much of an explanation.
ask21771 said
how do I ask him
Under Member Content where you find Bart’s Recent Posts, scroll down to Add a Comment. Type your question in the box and click Add Comment. Since it will be off-topic, suggest it as a Mailbag question.
May I suggest that you clarify your question before submitting it to Dr. Ehrman? The gospels all have differences and what’s found in one may not be in another. John is very different from Matthew, Mark and Luke. You will not find exactly the same things in all four gospels.
Judith said
ask21771 said
how do I ask himUnder Member Content where you find Bart’s Recent Posts, scroll down to Add a Comment. Type your question in the box and click Add Comment. Since it will be off-topic, suggest it as a Mailbag question.
May I suggest that you clarify your question before submitting it to Dr. Ehrman? The gospels all have differences and what’s found in one may not be in another. John is very different from Matthew, Mark and Luke. You will not find exactly the same things in all four gospels.
Ehrman has long argued that the Gospels don’t all say the same thing. Likewise, ask21771, this isn’t a spoon feeding forum. It’s not up to the members to keep you informed. In my own case, this sometimes happens. I read a post containing information or ideas, I wasn’t aware of BUT I don’t demand to have been informed.
Also I would note both your previous questions were readily answered
ask21771 said
besides the bible what other reasons are there to not believe the shroud is really jesus burial cloth
Pretty sure I cited key reasons of dating and an inability to tie the shroud to Jesus. It’s like saying a sheet has an image of a
Ford Mustang on it, therefore, it was so and sos car. What else would you need?
ask21771 said
I belive you used a passage of john to describe why it can’t be the burial cloth, but the other three gospels describe jesus being wrapped in a single burial cloth
Perhaps Matthew and Luke used Mark when writing their gospels, copying the part about the burial cloth from Mark?
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