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Buy a sword?!
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Jarek

936 Posts
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21
March 16, 2021 - 5:53 am

I said “buy a sword” out loud to hear the modern apocalyptic prophet in a minute from Antyradio Warsaw
O tempora o mores

 

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Stephen
4602 Posts
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March 16, 2021 - 1:34 pm

One thing about the passage in Mark 14:

Immediately, while he was still speaking, Judas, one of the twelve, arrived; and with him there was a crowd with swords and clubs, from the chief priests, the scribes, and the elders. Now the betrayer had given them a sign, saying, “The one I will kiss is the man; arrest him and lead him away under guard.” So when he came, he went up to him at once and said, “Rabbi!” and kissed him. Then they laid hands on him and arrested him. But one of those who stood near drew his sword and struck the slave of the high priest, cutting off his ear. Then Jesus said to them, “Have you come out with swords and clubs to arrest me as though I were a bandit? Day after day I was with you in the temple teaching, and you did not arrest me. But let the scriptures be fulfilled.” All of them deserted him and fled.

We have no NT manuscripts that lack the bolded verse.  So you can’t make a case for an interpolation on that basis. However you can’t help but notice how the verse stands out from the flow of the narrative.  It is Jesus’ antagonists who are armed.  And Jesus question in the verse following seems to be in direct response to the actions of the crowd in the verse preceding.  Read it without the bolded verse.  Makes me wonder.   

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Robert
7123 Posts
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March 16, 2021 - 1:53 pm
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janmaru

208 Posts
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March 16, 2021 - 7:14 pm

I would start with an analogy. Let’s presuppose that Einstein and Newton lived in the same physical world. While the first spoke in his dissertation on the special relativity of space-time, the latter lived in a mind space where the concept of “measure” was absolute and information could propagate instantly everywhere. 

Now if you told me that Newton or Pythagóras could understand a movie like Interstellar I would be surprised. The sensorial perception hasn’t changed much, sure. There hasn’t been an evolutionary step toward a new way to conceive time. But since there was no word that could describe such a cultural experience then even the “reality” of it didn’t happen.

The moment Gandhi spoke of “non-violence,” he might have been derived it from a previous philosophical or religious movement, he started a new experience. And this experience we can relate to, today.

I don’t know about Jesus. As you don’t. And Bart D. Erhman doesn’t. But Jesus has nothing to do with “non-violence.” Using a modern category of the mind to explain the past is very very bad historiography.

 

P.S.

I know about Jainism about Bagwan’s story about his father. Whatever is happening in Japan there is a fine line between cultural misappropriation and racism.

 

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Robert
7123 Posts
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March 16, 2021 - 7:25 pm
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janmaru

208 Posts
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26
March 16, 2021 - 7:58 pm

When we were in school studying Latin a common fun practice was to imagine how to translate common words like computer, airplane into the ancient language. It was very hard. But it’s also true the opposite.

I agree. The only way to study ancient texts is to learn the language. With a funny turn of events, since once you’ve learned you got trapped in it and concepts would keep being untranslated.

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Stephen
4602 Posts
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27
March 16, 2021 - 10:10 pm

Using a modern category of the mind to explain the past is very very bad historiography.  

But it’s been made abundantly clear that “non-violence” is not a modern category of the mind.  Why not do like the rest of us and simply admit you’re mistaken and learn from the experience?  The need to be perceived as right all the time is a serious character flaw. 

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janmaru

208 Posts
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28
March 17, 2021 - 4:49 am

My dear Stephen, I don’t know where did you get the impression that I want to be right all time! (pun intended) Maybe it says more about yourself than it describes who I am.
I was simply arguing. As many others do in this blog.
There is nothing personal.
Take care.

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Stephen
4602 Posts
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29
March 17, 2021 - 12:29 pm

I am always very careful to admit my mistakes because my goal is not to be mistaken.  Occasionally I succeed. 

e pur si muove

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