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kevinkrause

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January 20, 2025 - 2:18 pm

I understand that the only manuscripts of the gospels that we have are copies of copies of copies, etc. That being said, considering we don’t have any originals, how do we know what language the original manuscripts were written in? Based on listening to and reading Dr. Ehrman, I understand that it is Greek, but I’m not clear on how we know that. Thanks!

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Porphyry

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January 20, 2025 - 3:15 pm

1) Usually there are traces of the original language left in a translation: idioms that are normal in the original language but sound foreign in the target language (if you read a translation of the Psalms, it is still obviously foreign even when you read them in your own language), or wordplay that can’t be translated, or passages that make little sense in translation but when translated back into the original language suddenly make perfect sense or take on another level of meaning, or other such cases were the original language leaves traces (some subtle, some obvious) in the translation. There is very little of that to be found in the gospels (and what little there is is generally in sayings that likely are translations of older Aramaic saying).

2) Specifically with respect to the synoptics–the verbatim copying isn’t easily reconcilable with them being translations.

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Colin Milton

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January 25, 2025 - 3:36 pm

I thought it was Coptic Greek. (Egyptian)

That’s where the sigma Σ becomes a sigma C.

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Colin Milton

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January 25, 2025 - 3:48 pm

You won’t necessarily know anything with absolute certainty in great detail on this Earth unless you had personally experienced the events, and even then you might come to question your own recollection of the events as time goes on.

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Colin Milton

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January 25, 2025 - 4:15 pm

The texts are dated back according to appearance and an iffy scientific method called paleography.

If it looks really old and isn’t written in cursive style Greek, well it might be older than 1000 years ago because cursive minuscule Greek wasn’t invented until around 1000 years ago. 🤷‍♂️

Myself, I supposedly have a single page, a leaf, from a real first edition 1611 KJV that’s certified dated to around 350 years old that came included with a newly printed facsimile of the entire original print 1611 KJV. I also have several other Bibles that around 100 years old now.
I can’t tell a difference based on appearance; less than 300 years difference.

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Porphyry

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January 25, 2025 - 4:26 pm

The texts are dated back according to appearance and an iffy scientific method called paleography.

Kevin was asking about the language of the originals. not the dates of the copies.

If it looks really old and isn’t written in cursive style Greek, well it might be older than 1000 years ago because cursive minuscule Greek wasn’t invented until around 1000 years ago.

Paleography is necessarily imprecise, but it is a hell of a lot more precise than that description lets on. But to understand it, you need to study it, and spend a lot of time examining manuscripts with known dates.

Myself, I supposedly have a single page, a leaf, from a real first edition 1611 KJV that’s certified dated to around 350 years old that came included with a newly printed facsimile of the entire original print 1611 KJV. I also have several other Bibles that around 100 years old now. I can’t tell a difference based on appearance; less than 300 years difference.

Printed books are a completely different beast than hand-written books.

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