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Is Mark a Christian text?
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vincentjudea

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March 14, 2025 - 11:12 pm

I am currently studying to convert to Reform Judaism. I grew up in a not very devoted Christian family, who bounced around between denominations before finding a community in an Evangelical church when I was in middle school. Like Bart, in fact, I was convinced at the time of the bible’s divine inspiration, although I was aware very early on that the English translations (the number of which drove me nuts) were not the most accurate. I got my hands on an interlinear Greek to English bible, and, needless to say, I immediately started finding inconsistencies in the bible and the teachings of my pastor. Over time, I drifted further and further from Christianity, until eventually I realized, as a result of befriending an atheist who used to believe in Judaism, that the entire understanding of the “Old testament” that I had inherited was not only inaccurate to the original text, but entirely foreign to the authors of the text itself. The biggest example that shook me to my core was the interpretation of the events of the garden of Eden. In almost all Christian theology I have encountered, Adam and Eve’s decision to disobey god resulted in the famous “fall of man”, eternal and total separation form paradise, for all of mankind. As it turns out, the Jewish faith, from which the myth originates, holds no such belief AT ALL. This started my journey into a new understanding of the bible. For a while, I was a self proclaimed Atheist, who rejected all ideas of god and embraced cold hard empiricism. That is, until I met my partner, who is Jewish. We met at college, Cornell College in Iowa, and there I not only began to learn about Jewish culture and belief from my partner, but also other ideas and philosophies regarding religion that have drastically shifted my view into something like agnosticism, but which I have yet to fully describe or explain. However, I do find that the understandings of the world, life, meaning, death, and morality, that Judaism holds align with my own beliefs and intuitions in ways that I had never really thought possible. All this to say, I have recently begun to study the Tanakh and Jewish philosophy, in addition to my already intense studying of religious ideas in general. Recently, I have been listening to Bart’s podcast, Misquoting Jesus, as well as reading the book by the same name (among so many other books I am also reading) and lately I have found myself coming back time and time again to content on the Gospel of Mark. I find many things about the gospel fascinating, from the ways it seems to disagree with Pauline theology, to the disciples never understanding who Jesus really is, but one thing that has struck me (yesterday actually) is that the work does not seem to be necessarily “Christian”. It is Christian in that it believes Jesus to be the Messiah, but that appears to be the only thing that is “Christian” about it. In every other way, the work agrees entirely with Jewish religious beliefs, theology, history, and philosophy. I am curious as to whether there are any people out there who have observed this? As we know, Jesus was a Jew, and in many places in the gospel, supports upholding Jewish law. In fact, Jewish scholars have noted that the only things Jesus said that went against Judaism are when he claims to be the Messiah (obviously Jews disagreed then and do now) and when Jesus commands that people love their enemies, or turn the other cheek. Judaism commands love, but also commands that you fight against evil. However, throughout Christian texts, it is clear that the texts are being written to promote Christianity, or to explain Christian theology. Mark, on the other hand, does none of this. Mark appears (to my comparably uneducated or untrained eye at least) to be written by Jew explaining, not Christian teachings or theology, but Jewish theology regarding who the author believes is the Messiah, and how the Messiah can be a crucified criminal rather than a heroic leader. It almost seems like more of an insight into ancient Jewish belief during the Roman Empire than an insight into Christian belief. Now, obviously, Christianity came from Judaism, and so naturally Mark, the earliest gospel, would have a stronger Jewish influence than the other gospels, but just reading Mark and hearing about it from the perspective of a textual critic, I really find it to be uniquely Jewish in ways that the others are not, and uniquely NOT Christian in ways that the others ARE. Just a thought and idea that I wanted to toss out there to see what other people think.

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Porphyry

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March 15, 2025 - 8:20 am

I’d be curious to hear what, specifically, you find in Mark that is distinctively Jewish.

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Robert
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March 15, 2025 - 9:29 am
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Stephen
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March 15, 2025 - 4:06 pm

Vincent, welcome.

Much of critical scholarship has come down on the side of the author of Mark being a gentile convert. I think there is some reason to suppose he might have been a diaspora Jew, like Paul. (Although any actual Pauline influence on Mark is debatable.)

Mark does assume a great deal of knowledge of the Hebrew scriptures on the part of his audience.

But what tips me over the line are Mark’s themes. Mark is radically redefining the Jewish concept of the Messiah. He rejects the traditional Davidic triumphalist view in favor of a Messiah who must suffer and be killed. Also, Mark associates the fate of Jesus and the coming of the Parousia with the fate of the Temple. It’s been said that in the latter part of the gospel the Temple is almost a character in the book. I just wonder why a gentile, for whom the cultural significance of these themes would be marginal at best, would make them the core of his gospel?

Now people point out that Mark is dodgy at best about Palestinian geography and Jewish custom, and that he seems to assume his audience recognizes but cannot speak Aramaic.

I know the descendants of expats who are just as dodgy about the language and customs of the Old Country as Mark is. And I understand Prof Ehrman’s position is that Paul could not understand Aramaic. I think we can say with assurance that Mark was not a Galilean or a Judean. But if he was raised and educated somewhere else?

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Colin Milton

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March 16, 2025 - 11:40 am

If Mark was a Jewish text it would have begun with The Genealogy. Mark like Luke, was one of Paul’s PhD interns, and Paul didn’t like the Genealogy stuff. 1 Timothy 1:4.

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BJH1960

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March 17, 2025 - 1:15 am

Hi, Vincent. It’s great to have another voice and perspective.

You started this thread to discuss whether Mark is a Christian text, and I don’t want to disrupt that. However, I must say I would love to hear more about this:

I not only began to learn about Jewish culture and belief from my partner, but also other ideas and philosophies regarding religion that have drastically shifted my view into something like agnosticism, but which I have yet to fully describe or explain.

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Stephen
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March 17, 2025 - 12:50 pm

This an addendum to BJH1960.

Vincent I’ve been fascinated by the idea of “conversion” since an acquaintance of mine studying for the ministry in a Christian denomination wound up becoming a Tibetan Buddhist monk. Circumstances prevented me from ever discussing his thinking with him, even of course assuming it had been any of my business in the first place. That’s why I’m leery of poking my nose into personal affairs but I am fascinated by other people’s stories. This place is in no way an inquisition. But to the level you’re comfortable discussing it please consider this an invitation.

We have a thread where people share their journeys if you like.

** you do not have permission to see this link **

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