
Robert said
Coimbra, who are you quoting here? Please cite your sources. I would not trust that dating of P66 to 110-150 CE. I’ve seen recent discussions of expert paleographers discussing whether or not P66 should be dated to the third or fourth century.Nongbri has articles on the dating of both P66 as well as P75:
Brent Nongbri, “The Limits of Palaeographic Dating of Literary Papyri: Some Observations on the Date and Provenance of P. Bodmer II (P66),” Museum Helveticum 71 (2014): 1-35.
Brent Nongbri, “Reconsidering the Place of Papyrus Bodmer XIV-XV (P75) in the Textual Criticism of the New Testament,” JBL 135.2 (2016): 405-37.
You really should check out his blog. He’s a very friendly and helpful scholar.
Hello Robert,
This is not my publication, thus, it is not me who should be providing the source or some sort of quotations. I have read this posting in another Forum Discussion at Facebook.

Robert said
If you’re the one quoting someone here, why wouldn’t you want to tell us whom you are quoting? But, no worrys, perhaps we can begin a source-critical study.Well, let’s see. This paragraph of yours, based upon your Facebook source:
Michael Kruger talks about the widespread nature of this evidence, “What we find is incredible uniformity across the board for the titles of these gospels, Matthew’s Gospel is called ‘Matthew’; Mark’s is called ‘Mark’. It is amazingly consistent, something we would not expect if the titles were added later.”[5]
is very similar to this paragraph from ** you do not have permission to see this link **:
Michael Kruger speaks about the universal nature of this evidence, “What we find is incredible uniformity across the board for the titles of these gospels, Matthew’s Gospel is called ‘Matthew’; Mark’s is called ‘Mark’. It is amazingly consistent, something we would not expect if the titles were added later.”5
Likewise, this same putative source has this paragraph:
In the Codex Sinaiticus and the Codex Vaticanus, two of our earliest codices from the fourth century,
the name Matthew, Mark, Luke or John appears at the beginning and end of their respective gospels
exactly as we would expect according to the custom of that time. It is the same for the two earliest fragments of the gospels that have a section of the manuscript with a name, p75 and p66.which is somewhat expanded by your Facebook source:
In the Codex Sinaiticus (330-360 C.E.), the Codex Vaticanus (300-330 C.E.), two of our earliest and most trusted codices, and the Codex Alexandrinus (400-440 C.E.),
the name Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John are found at the beginning and at the end of their particular gospels
precisely as one would expect them to be according to the custom of the time. Moreover, we find exactly the same with two of our earliest Greek New Testament papyri manuscripts, P75 (175-225 C.E.) and P66 (110-150 C.E.).The format of the expansion is already found in this sentence of the potential source:
The earliest actual manuscripts with the author’s name on it are Luke on p75 (c.175-225 C.E.)
and John on p66 (c.200 C.E.).4and is further expanded and again exaggerated in the Facebook source:
the earliest Greek New Testament manuscripts with the Gospel author’s name on it are Luke on P75 (175-225 C.E.)
and John on P66 (110-150 C.E.).[4]Thus we have not yet found the source of the P66 exaggeration. Is this exaggeration about the date of P66 from the mysterious unnamed Facebook poster? Isn’t source-criticism fun!
Well, I thought I have quoted the person responsible for this claims. It is a scholar by the name of Edward Andrews (not the actor, though). I Follow him at facebook and here are his degrees (Christian author of 140+ books, Chief Translator of the UASV, has an MDiv., MA, BS, and AA).

Robert said
If you’re the one quoting someone here, why wouldn’t you want to tell us whom you are quoting? But, no worrys, perhaps we can begin a source-critical study.
The source I have cited above from Facebook has a new book released this year:
THE P52 PROJECT: Is P52 Really the Earliest Greek New Testament Manuscript? Paperback – May 26, 2020
Here is the link for it: ** you do not have permission to see this link **
About the Author

Robert said
Wow. You really need to balance your reading materials; especially the recommended articles on P52 and P66 by Nongbri.So, what do you think, was Ron Jones plagiarizing Edward D. Andrews, or was Edward D. Andrews plagiarizing Ron Jones? Who really was the original author of the material you quoted?
LOL…Good one

Robert said
Yes, funny, but seriously, wouldn’t you like to know who plagiarized whom?If I were to show this to my high school kids, they would be shocked. I’ve showed them other published examples, which were less egregious, and they couldn’t believe someone would do that. They have been taught very well to always cite their sources and to use quotation marks when copying word-for-word. Integrity–it’s important.
ETA: I just showed this to my 15-year-old youngest son, who is finishing his Sophomore year in high school tomorrow, and he thought this was freakin’ hilarious. Fundamentalists really need to up their game.
No doubt and I agree with you ???? %.

Robert said
Why not show the evidence to your Facebook friend and ask him?
Actually I have asked him and here is what he responded to me. Quote:
Moises Rodrigues Coimbra Source Criticism is the poison that destroys faith like the rest of your higher criticism. Just ask Bart D. Ehrman.
** you do not have permission to see this link **
Coimbra1982 said
Actually I have asked him and here is what he responded to me. Quote:
Moises Rodrigues Coimbra Source Criticism is the poison that destroys faith like the rest of your higher criticism. Just ask Bart D. Ehrman.
** you do not have permission to see this link **
I guess your buddy doesn’t know Prof Ehrman’s actual biography. His scholarly studies didn’t do it. But I agree with your friend, historical critical method does destroy faith. Because any system of belief that can’t withstand contact with the truth is not worth very many regrets.
I must say Prof Ehrman seems to fulfill the role of Satan in many an evangelical pantheon. Jeepers what would they do without him? What did Voltaire say? If Prof Ehrman did not exist it would have been necessary to invent him.
Coimbra1982
The Bible gives us four accounts of Christ’s life. Each records a unique perspective of the most significant event in history—the crucifixion and resurrection.
Steefen
The biblical Jesus is not one unique, biological, historical person: he is a composite figure of historical fiction.
The crucifixion and resurrection of this composite figure of historical fiction has no significant events in history because he was not one unique, biological, historical person.
Robert said
I think most believe he was Joseph, of course, or perhaps some unknown person. A few actually give some attention to Jewish traditions (and even a Greek inscription in Germany) that provide variations on Pantera, a Roman soldier. James Tabor has made a lot of posts on this possibility as can be seen ** you do not have permission to see this link **. It is also commonly believed that the origin of the name Pantheros may have been merely a pun on parthenos, the Greek word for virgin.
Go on, either you are a student or scholar of the gospels are you are going to pull it apart or put it together to suit your own purposes. Go right ahead and corrupt the gospels of Matthew and Luke. If both gospels wanted Jesus to be known as a biological person, they would have recorded that. Meanwhile, all of your scholars are speculating, projecting their reality onto the writers of the gospels.
So, Joseph was not telling the truth when he said, I did not have sex with that woman?
The Bible made up a composite character of historical fiction and you want to make this character real according to your reality. If enough critical scholars can create propaganda, Jesus can be real, Lord, and God. Go on, get yourself lost.
BDEhrman
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