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heavenly witnesses (1 John 5:7) - rethinking the Trinitarian-Arian-Sabellian issues in the Ante-Nicene church
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stevenavery

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September 28, 2021 - 6:49 pm
This relates to a blog post :).
 
How the Trinity Got Into the New Testament
Bart Ehrman – Jan 7, 2021
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1 John 5:7 (AV)
For there are three that bear record in heaven,
the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost:
and these three are one.
 
Let’s examine the basic theory here!
“doctrine of the Trinity … three distinct persons … all of whom are completely and equally God … existed forever … same essence/substance. ..actually one .. three persons.”
 

A lot of conjectural extrapolation is needed to make the heavenly witnesses fit the above!  Those phrases are not in the text, and you have to put on modern doctrinal glasses to try to connect them to the heavenly witnesses verse!  The verse itself is much simpler, without all that baggage.

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In the first centuries the heavenly witnesses could easily be rejected as Sabellian and non-Trinitarian. As pointed out by various scholars, including Edward Freer Hills (1912-1981). Also Thomas Smith, Frederick Nolan and Edward Burton were among those who emphasized these doctrinal issues.

Hills Revisited (2003) Jon Whitmer:
And since the Sabellian heresy was especially extensive among the Greek-speaking Church, this theory explains why the Johannine Comma might not have continued in the Greek NT, while being “preserved in the Latin texts of Africa and Spain, where the influence of Sabellianism was probably not so great.” – Edward F. Hills, The King Janies Version Defended ” –

The full, longer Edward Freer Hills section:
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=========================

Note this from Eusebius of Caesarea, the church historian from the 4th century.

τὸ δὲ αὐτὸν εἶναι τοῦ ἐν αὐτῷ λόγου πατέρα, καὶ υἱὸν αὐτοῦ τὸν ἐν αὐτῷ λόγον, τῆς Σαβελλίου κακοδοξίας ἦν γνώρισμα, 3.4.1 ὡς αὖ πάλιν καὶ τὸ λέγειν τὰ τρία ἓν εἶναι, τὸν πατέρα καὶ τὸν υἱὸν καὶ τὸ ἅγιον πνεῦμα· Σαβελλίου γὰρ καὶ τοῦτο.

“[To say] that the Father is the same as the Word inside him, and that his Son is the Word inside him is the mark of the heresy of Sabellius. So again also the saying that the Three are One, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit; for this is also of Sabellius.”

Eusebius of Caesarea (260-340 AD), De Ecclesiastica Theologia Book 3 Chapter III to Chapter IV
Migne Graeca, PG 24 [1001D to 1004A]

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This quote only came to English recently, and into discussions about the heavenly witnesses text.

It is sensible to understand that the heavenly witnesses text is authentic New Testament scripture. And it dropped out of most of the Greek line under the doctrinal pressures of the day, likely combined with homoeoteleuton to create the split line.  And the theories that claim the heavenly witnesses as an “interpolation” have very great difficulties.

=========================

Steven Avery
Dutchess County, NY USA

 
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Steefen
7663 Posts
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September 29, 2021 - 8:14 pm

Steve Campbell, author of Historical Accuracy

1 John Chapter 5, Verses 7-8 (NET Bible)

For there are three who testify:
the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three are in agreement.

Young’s Literal Translation of verse 8
and three are who are testifying in the earth,
the Spirit, and the water, and the blood, and the three are into the one.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And there are three that give testimony on earth: the spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three are one.

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stevenavery

15 Posts
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September 30, 2021 - 8:59 am

Hi Steve,

The Douay Rheims and Young’s Literal do have the heavenly witnesses. 🙂

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