I’m talking about the angel(s) of the lord, who, when you’ve wrestled with them you have wrestled with the lord, or when you’ve seen them have seen the lord face to face.
Many Hebrew scholars regard the development of the figure of the “angel of the Lord” as an intermediary by scribes who became more and more uncomfortable with the portrayal of the embodied god of their earliest sources. For a riveting discussion of this idea go ** you do not have permission to see this link **. The angel of the Lord would have seemed a natural and obvious precursor to Christ by the early Christians as they searched their scriptures.
brenmcg said
The angel of the lord is only a natural and obvious precursor to Christ by early Christians if they already see Christ as Lord on earth.Nobody who is taught that Christ is just a man would see it that way.
True but I simply note as early as Paul you already have the development of a very high Christology. It seems clear that there were many early believers whose imaginations soared to the empyrean.
If you’re not already familiar with it, allow me to recommend Charles Gieschen’s ANGELOMOPHIC CHRISTOLOGY. An astounding work.
Jesus was the wine poured in a cup that already existed.
Stephen said
True but I simply note as early as Paul you already have the development of a very high Christology. It seems clear that there were many early believers whose imaginations soared to the empyrean.
If you’re not already familiar with it, allow me to recommend Charles Gieschen’s ANGELOMOPHIC CHRISTOLOGY. An astounding work.
Jesus was the wine poured in a cup that already existed.
I suggest you DON’T read it. “Scholars” have, as their starting point, the theory that there is no God and if we have to refer to any god then we haven’t learned anything. Thus all scripture has to be “explained” with this perspective. Barbara Tiering for instance “explained” Jesus walking on the water by the device of a slightly submerged jetty. Her “argument” was quite clever and I give her ten points for that subterfuge. “Explaining away” is not explaining at all – it’s dismissing. Strange things DO happen, the universe is more strange than we CAN imagine. Just look at the resurrection of Israel as a nation to see that – and that was prophesied as the Jews coming back a “second time” in Isaiah – said at a time when the Jews hadn’t returned the first time. Even back then lots in the bible was considered incredulous.
NonestDeusMagnus said
Just an ordinary inquisitive mind researching the lies, corruption and fraud in ALL holy books, but sadly no answers here!
Just lots of pseudo intellectual, theoretical, conceptual, notional, philosophical, acrobatics.
Sorry this wasn’t what you wanted! Perhaps you would be happier on YouTube where all the real intellectuals gather.
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