“he without sin cast the first stone”
Since people who read text like this have no idea about literarly techniques even today, one would think jesus himself is not free from sin. So my question is why would an interpolater make jesus say something which could inplicate jesus ?
jakejones said
“he without sin cast the first stone”Since people who read text like this have no idea about literarly techniques even today, one would think jesus himself is not free from sin. So my question is why would an interpolater make jesus say something which could inplicate jesus ?
I think what is missing here is that Jesus lacks a motivation to cast that stone. It isn’t a command that the person without sin must cast the first stone, merely a designation that if anyone is to cast the first stone, that person should be without sin (which, of course, no one in that crowd qualifies as). Mostly, it is an injunction for the mob to realize that they are not themselves guiltless and should not be so quick to judge others. It says nothing at all about Jesus himself.
This story has so many interesting aspects to it. Where’s the adulterer? What did Jesus write? Whence comes this late addition to John?
Ehrman wrote a monograph a few years back arguing it is a concatenation of two early traditions, one about a guilty woman and the other about an innocent one.
An early 20th century scholar, whose name I’ve long forgotten, argued that the story originated in Mark, passed through Luke, and finally landed in John.
jakejones said
“he without sin cast the first stone”Since people who read text like this have no idea about literarly techniques even today, one would think jesus himself is not free from sin. So my question is why would an interpolater make jesus say something which could inplicate jesus ?
He doesn’t really say “he without sin … ” he says “the sinless one among you (plural) … ” referring to those who have brought the woman for stoning. He doesn’t include himself among them.
CEJ said
This story has so many interesting aspects to it. Where’s the adulterer? What did Jesus write? Whence comes this late addition to John?Ehrman wrote a monograph a few years back arguing it is a concatenation of two early traditions, one about a guilty woman and the other about an innocent one.
An early 20th century scholar, whose name I’ve long forgotten, argued that the story originated in Mark, passed through Luke, and finally landed in John.
Whether it was written in the first or fourth centuries, it was, without question, always intended to be placed precisely where it is now between John 7:52 and John 8:12.
the guy who invented the text shared the same view as modern day christians? if he believed that yhwh commanded the stoning of adulterers and he thought jesus was yhwh and without sin, jesus was the “sinless one” among them. or maybe the guy who invented the text had no problem seeing jesus as sinner,
“where are you condemners” ? “go, neither do i condemn you”
jakejones said
the guy who invented the text shared the same view as modern day christians?
Modern day christians share the same view as the guy who invented the text. Which is hardly surprising, they read his text as gospel after all.
if he believed that yhwh commanded the stoning of adulterers and he thought jesus was yhwh and without sin, jesus was the “sinless one” among them. or maybe the guy who invented the text had no problem seeing jesus as sinner,“where are you condemners” ? “go, neither do i condemn you”
John 1:17 “the law was given through Moses, grace and truth came through Jesus Christ”.
This story is an example of the grace being brought through Jesus Christ.
did yhwh command that adulterers get stonned? Yes or no. What does deut 32 say about yhwhs righteous and eternal laws?
yhwh gave sinners his righteous and eternal laws
yhwh commanded sinners to take out adulterers.
jesus brought in a new belief:
If the woman continued in her adultery, no one, not even jesus can pick up stones to stone her . Why? Because like her accusers , jesus suffered from adultery and idolatry of the heart.
jakejones said
so what does “he who is free from sin cast the first stone “mean ?its a spiritual thing, isnt it?
You are, perhaps intentionally, misquoting this section (since you have done the same thing every time you give the quote). All translations use “let” or “may,” depending on the overall phrasing. None that I am aware of give this as a requirement or obligation. That distinction is clearly a significant one, at least to anyone who is not trying to impose a new meaning. Brenmcg has already given the more theological interpretation. The whole idea of Jesus’ ministry is to overturn rigid adherence to the laws of Leviticus. If he was to merely enforce them, he would have spent his entire time stoning people.
We not talking about “rijid adherance” we talking about repeated offenders and yhwhs “holy ” command to execute . jesus was addressing torah believing jews, not modern day christians who hate yhwhs holy teachings.
The torah says that to adhere to its teachings brings blessings and disobediance to its teachings brings curses.
jesus.came along.and added a new teaching which implicate jesus in my opinion.
Too much adherance to “grace, mercy and love” created an effect which allowed repeated offenders to live happily ever after
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