The Failed Apocalypse of The New Testament – Dr. James D Tabor
Jesus had a false prophecy of an apocalypse.
Paul had a false prophecy of an apocalypse.
Revelation had a false prophecy of an apocalypse.
Dr. Tabor:
I come to this as a historian.
The first thing I tell my students, first day, is
We’re beginning the study of an idea in the West: Messianic Apocalyptic Eschatology
and so far, it has a 100% failure rate.
This is a course in When Prophecy Fails.
We’re starting 100 years before Jesus–The Dead Sea Scrolls. Expectation, Disappointment, and Failure
of an apocalyptic, messianic eschatological group before Jesus.
Read the Habakkuk Pesher.
Habakkuk is in the The Holy Bible. It talks about the End.
If the End tarries, wait for it. – Habakkuk 2: 3
The righteous person will live by faith. Having faith that the End should be waited for makes you righteous.
HOWEVER, Paul says the Just shall live by faith.
It’s in Romans and Galatians.
He who through faith is righteous shall live.
IF IT TARRIES, WAIT FOR IT.
Okay, the Teacher died and didn’t come back, AD70 and the First, Second, AND Third Jewish Roman War happened.
Paul pulls Habakkuk OUT OF CONTEXT, it is no longer apocalyptic.
Furthermore, in Paul’s Parousia (Second Coming of Christ), the dead will rise and meet Jesus in the air.
You can spiritualize and allegorize anything literal.
Then we have a new creation. Creation itself will be set free from its bondage to decay.
What does that mean? Eternal life.
Steefen:
Well, you can say that happens individually, when a person dies. But on a global scale that Parousia did not happen.
Daniel 9: 26
Jerusalem AND the Sanctuary will be destroyed.
Steefen
Jesus’ apocalyptic vision comes from Daniel 9:26
Prof. Tabor
BUT, Jesus thought the Son of Man was going to give us a New Jerusalem and a New Temple.
You cannot stretch Daniel for thousands of years ! ! !
You cannot stretch Daniel even to AD 70.
= = = = Next video is Bart Ehrman’s video.
Typically Matthew 24:36 is quoted so that time can be extended to whenever. But that’s bogus reasoning.
I think in context “the day and hour unknown” is supposed to be within the time frame of the “this generation” of Matthew 24:34.
I think such claims are a violation of Deuteronomy 18:22. The people do not have to live in fear of a prophecy any longer than the life of the prophet or generation it was spoken to. Legitimate prophecy cannot speak of times 120 years or more in the future.
Genesis 6:3 and the 120 years is applied to Matthew 24:37 as the timeframe for when the coming of the son of man would occur as a prophecy of Daniel 7:13.
That’s my opinion on it all.
The Failed Apocalypse of Jesus – Dr. Bart D. Ehrman
Prof. Ehrman:
What do you mean by saved?
Do you mean saved only happens when Jesus comes back and says you can enter into the kingdom of the Son of Man
or will you not be saved and you won’t get in?
= = =
Paul looked at the second part of Isaiah and saw himself as the light to the nations (nations other than Judea-Israel).
Paul thinks these prophecies are about him. Paul is the light of the world. Paul is the fulfillment of God’s promises.
Salvation is not based on the old covenant, it’s based on Christ.
= = =
Prof. Ehrman:
Is it your sense that everyone who died was raised in the year 70?
It’s predicting something that did not happen.
Steefen:
So, yes, the Apocalypse of Jesus failed, because it didn’t happen, neither Jesus’ apocalypse nor Paul’s apocalypse.’
Prof. Ehrman:
The early Christians didn’t think AD70 was the fulfillment.
And it did not happen soon.
God was extending the time to give more people time to repent, some would say.
There are all sorts of explanations.
There is nothing that shows the kingdom of God came to earth in AD70, the dead were resurrected, and the heavenly Jerusalem came down.
Then if you say, don’t take it literally, what then binds you? You can come up with anything if you’re not constrained.
= = = Next Video: Christian Apologist Won’t Tell You This
There is nothing that shows the kingdom of God came to earth in AD70, the dead were resurrected, and the heavenly Jerusalem came down.
Hey it’s not our fault if you didn’t notice.
The Kingdom of the Father is spread over the earth and men do not see it.
-Gospel of Thomas 113
@Stephen
The Son of Man coming on the clouds is a figure of speech that means “they’re going to be killed”
Jesus spoke it also referring to himself meaning that he would be killed.
Stephen saw it before he died Acts 7:54-59
Matthew 26:62-67
Jesus basically spoke prophecy to the Sanhedrin meaning they were going to be killed. They were extremely offended by such a statement. They took it as a death threat and insurrection. They sent him away to the courts.
They asked Jesus if he was the Messiah and King of Israel. Jesus said he was, but they were all going to be killed in a very horrendous event. Therefore Jesus cannot be the Messiah because the messiah would bring peace to the world, not a war. Isaiah 2:4.
Relevant to Daniel 7, you hypothetically want to be those who are the Son of Man, because to see the Son of Man coming meant you were going to lose the war and be killed.
Video: Christian Apologist Won’t Tell You This | Jesus Predicted The End of The World & It Failed
Dale Allison:
Mark 13 and Matthew 24, we find the stars will fall from the sky making the Apocalypse cosmic.
Matthew 24:29
New International Version
“Immediately after the distress of those days “’the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’
Mark 13: 25
New International Version
the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’
pick up at 15:16
@Stephen
I’m going to use Daniel 7 as the main example where the literal prophecy is not exactly the same as the interpretation. In Daniel 7:16 the prophecy/dream is interpreted for Daniel.
The son of man coming on clouds from heaven is from Daniel 7:13. From the chapter it can be understood that the son of man is the holy people. Verses 27, 22, and 18 are the reasoning. I did not invent this myself.
However I might have invented this. I don’t know. I doubt it.
Here it goes, cross my fingers.
The son of man coming on clouds of heaven. I’m sticking with the Daniel 7 reasoning that the son of man is the holy people of God. Now, the clouds of heaven needs to be translated. I use Exodus 14:19 to suggest that the cloud is the angel/spirit of God. Heaven could be the litereral supernatural realm, however in Matthew 8:20 and Matthew 6:20 the same Greek word is translated as “air”.
The son of man coming on clouds from heaven.
The holy people of God coming on the spirit of God.
Daniel 7 is about a war. The expression “son of man coming on clouds of heaven” is Jewish for “the victorious holy people of God being protected by the spirit of God during the war such as how Moses and the Israelites were protected from the Egyptians during the Exodus.”
In context of Matthew 26:64 Jesus is speaking about a war that will defeat and remove the Sanhedrin from Jerusalem. Jesus flip flops the ancient prophecy into meaning it as a curse against the Sanhedrin, rather than it defending them from the Roman Empire. This war was the 70 AD event of the Jewish Roman Wars. However, the followers of Jesus (holy people) and other pious Jews also did not win the war and receive the kingdom of Israel, so it’s really a false prophecy.
Why is it now much too late to fulfill this prophecy? Because in Matthew 24:37 (as in the days of Noah) that is Jewish for a timeframe of 120 years, derived from Genesis 6:3 as that Noah was told he had 120 years max to complete the building of the Ark.
The end.
@Robert
Is Colin translating correctly above?
Son of Man is Holy People?
Why not Sons of Man?
Cloud is angel/spirit of God?
And this:
Heaven could be the litereral supernatural realm, however in Matthew 8:20 and Matthew 6:20 the same Greek word is translated as “air”.
The son of man coming on clouds from heaven.
The holy people of God coming on the spirit of God.
= = = =
I’m not translating, I’m interpreting the idioms. The clouds of heaven is the angel:spirit of the LORD. In Daniel 7:13, the being “like a son of man” is being transported via an angel.
Daniel 7 is a dream. Nothing is literal. Everything in the dream is symbolic. God is the ancient of days, the clouds of heaven is an angel, the one like a son of man is the righteous people of Israel and King David, the beasts are pagan kings,
Now for the madness to begin. Daniel 9:20-27.
The Sevens are a concept of time, but are the individual reigns of pagan kings within the pagan kingdoms. And yes, 7+62+1=70, but it’s really the number 111. (7*7)+62 and the missing 1 (112-1)=111 and the idiom for the abomination of desolation. It is the Hebrew word “Hadad” which is Baal. The Hebrew word for the number 111 is Hadad. If you don’t like that math equation, the Hebrew word for the number 69 means stone, and that refers to the apostle Peter, Matthew 16:18. This is why people shouldn’t play with numbers and magic.
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A king:beast Hadad 111 was going to declare himself to be Baal at the temple in Jerusalem while the resurrected King David and the holy ones of the Most High (Ezekiel 37:24) but then God shows up (Zachariah 14:9)and defeats Baal, Hadad to complete the final 1 (reign of a king). King David is the prince of Israel forever, while God rules as king over the entire Earth forever. Psalm 110:1
Ezekiel 37:24
Zechariah 14:9
BDEhrman
FreedomBen
evgendob
Robert