Loading...The 1993 Waco Disaster—How Not to Negotiate with Apocalyptic Believers
James D. Tabor, retired professor of Religious Studies, UNC Charlotte
In this three-part series James Tabor surveys what happened 30 years ago outside Waco, TX as Federal authorities violently confronted a group of apocalyptic believers who believed that David Koresh, their prophetic leader was a final messianic messenger of the book of Revelation.
Part III: A Peaceful Surrender Plan Rejected!
Dr. Phillip Arnold and I offered our services to the FBI on March 7. As biblical scholars we had specialized in the history of biblical apocalyptic interpretation and were generally familiar with Adventist groups although neither of us had ever heard of David Koresh and the Branch Davidians before February 28. We studied carefully the fifty-eight-minute tape that Koresh had released on March 2 and began many hours of theological conversation over the telephone with Livingstone Fagan. Fagan had been sent out of Mount Carmel by Koresh on March 23 to act as a theological spokesperson for the Davidians; he was now being held in jail in Waco on charges stemming from the February 28 BATF raid. He holds a graduate degree in theology and is an articulate defender of Koresh’s teachings.
Arnold and I hoped to build on this point with Koresh, emphasizing that given his interpretation of the Bible, right or wrong, one might not necessarily understand the standoff at Waco as a fulfillment of the penultimate End Time scenario. It was clear that Koresh desperately wanted the FBI to recognize his skill and wisdom in the Scriptures.
We began to formulate a more carefully worked-out plan to communicate with Koresh. Ron Engleman, host of a daily talk show over station KGBS, had shown sympathy toward the Branch Davidians from the day of the initial BATF raid. His program was faithfully followed by those inside Mount Carmel. On April 1, Arnold and I spoke on Engleman’s show and discussed in some detail the prophetic technicalities of the Waco situation as it might be viewed by the Branch Davidians. Although this program took the form of a dialogue between Arnold and me, it was deliberately pitched for the ears of Koresh and his followers and was designed to show that someone outside was listening and capable of discussing the book of Revelation on a level the Davidians could appreciate. Around this time
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James,
1. Do you believe law enforcement agencies have learned anything from this tragedy – since apocalyptic beliefs can have such horrible outcomes why do they not keep specialists like yourself in the loop on a regular basis – like a contractor maybe a once a month update meeting on any current groups – and seek advice?
2. I really enjoyed reading The Jesus Dynasty – I’ve also read most of Robert Eisenmans work and he also has a very high view of James brother of Jesus. To me the two of you seem to agree on many things regarded James. Have you two ever discussed your views together – how do you think are they similiar or different?
TY,
SC
Yes, absolutely, in fact the FBI has been meeting with Religious Studies scholars of apocalyptic and other modern religious movements for years now and there are good results, such as the peaceful resolution of the Montana Freedman standoff some years ago…Dr. Arnold was involved and instrumental in helping resolve things.
Hi James,
I found it surprising that you thought the fact that the original allegations came from ex-members made them less reliable (that was at least my impression from reading the text, excuse me if I’m misrepresenting you). Wouldn’t those be basically the only people who could both know about the abuse and be willing to speak to it? Outsiders wouldn’t know about it, and people inside may not find anything wrong with it, so if it were true where else could it come from but from ex-members?
David Thibodeau in his memoir stated that Koresh married Michelle Jones when she was 12, and that they had children together when she was fourteen.
My feeling from reading these texts is that you don’t believe there was any merit to the allegations of child abuse. Is that your position? If so, what do you make of the stuff above?
PS: This is in no way support for the criminal way in which the whole thing was handled. I am just curious about your thoughts on the child abuse as someone who has delved deep into the issue.
I totally understand your point here and it is covered quite thoroughly in my book, Why Waco…I talked to Marc Brault and other former members extensively in my research, so I did not at all leave out any of their perspectives. I hope you can read the book to get the wider picture–and not trying to promote the book here, but I spent two years researching it full time with a year off from teaching…it really digs deep into all these aspects and Gene Gallagher’s contributions are golden…my co-author, and perhaps the best scholar on NRM in the country…unless that would be Gordon Melton or Cathy Wessinger!
Really? A detailed thoughtful question is rewarded with “Buy my book” ?
Bobby, I think that response is very rude and unfair. I let it through anyway, but the idea that my goal here is to “sell books” is insulting to me as a scholar and a caring human being. What Gallagher and I present in that book is available nowhere else, so I point you to the best resource. Beyond that, I have posted and published countless materials you don’t have to “buy” if you are really interested in dealing with the topic of “What Happened at Waco” 30 years ago today–just take a look at the hundreds of “free” materials in my blog post this morning:
https://jamestabor.com/the-waco-tragedy-looking-back-after-thirty-years/
As for “buying books,” you might consider Bart’s latest, as he has a very fine treatment of Waco and the ways such groups fit into a broader history of Prophecy Belief through the ages…
No that is not my position at all. I hope you can take the time to delve into the body of materials I have put together in my blog post this morning. Perhaps the most relevant to your question would be the 3 hour YouTube video, linked therein. Also, in our book, Why Waco? Gallagher and I go thoroughly into all the evidence. https://jamestabor.com/the-waco-tragedy-looking-back-after-thirty-years/
I’ll do, and the book is on its way to my home as we speak 🙂 Thanks for taking the time to answer!
Can you state, in sum, what you make of the child abuse allegations that come from the accusers themselves? I watched the Australian 60 Minutes interview last night with Graeme and they feature an interview with a Kiri Jewell who says she was abused by David when she was 11. Are these people misremembering? Lying? If you dispute the testimony then I’d be interested in seeing your blogs analysis of this evidence.
Thank you so much for this series of articles that brings to light the Branch Davidian tragedy in Waco. This is the best information I’ve seen to date on the subject.
Thanks so much for taking the time to read through. Yes, the mainstream media has really botched this one with the typical “crazed cult leader/brainwashed idiots who follow” narrative, removing all humanness from this sad story. See Bart’s book for countless disasters that such apocalyptic views have facilitated in history…a strange combination of hope and despair.
Glad you found it of benefit. We are always trying to get “closer to truth” in what went wrong with Waco…much more on my blog post tomorrow, be sure and check back: https://jamestabor.com/the-waco-tragedy-looking-back-after-thirty-years/
Have the FBI managers (who misinformed Reno on her decision) been penalized for this act?
I truly think that the conspiracy theorists’ attitude is not an outcome of paranoia; but it is a “natural” outcome in the system that comes from the obvious governmental systematic coverups for long periods.
There have been a lot of post-Waco congressional hearings and yet overall, the Federal narrative is the dominating one, and I would recommend the resources here: https://jamestabor.com/the-waco-tragedy-looking-back-after-thirty-years/
Hi James,
Thank you for the read. I recently watched the Netflix documentary on Waco.
How do you think the leader (David) and other Davidians think or believe about their own religious suicides with the children? Is that not of God and a sin to “go before your ‘time’?”
Did they think they were being called to create the fire instead of surrendering or walking out of the building? Although the documentary and interviews cover a lot of questions, these are some thoughts not covered in the documentary.
There’s a recording of a mother saying she didn’t want to surrender because they would ‘just put her in jail like the other mom’ that was released to speak to her son then sent to jail (3years I believe, for being an accomplice). That recorded comment gave the impression that they were already starting to think of self deliverance methods instead of surrender.
The religious fear and brainwashing I can relate to from personal experience. Another good example of religious brainwashing is the documentary Stay sweet, obey and pray about Warren Jeffs. It would be interesting to read your thoughts on that.
Unfortunately, the latest Netflix documentary, Waco Apocalypse, although incredibly well produced, is totally inaccurate in many serious ways. Much of this is covered in the basic materials on my blog post this morning. I hope you will have time to explore these sources: https://jamestabor.com/the-waco-tragedy-looking-back-after-thirty-years/
Wow! Thanks so much for these posts. They were very informative. I had a very different idea at the time of what happened.
Glad this was helpful…see my latest: https://youtu.be/Q4KCXlzqhQI
Plus the blog post I have mentioned about 10 times today on these comments! 🙂
The hammer only sees nails. Your book as well as Benjamin Zeller’s book on Heaven’s Gate are must reads. It would be foolish to think there aren’t more of these folks out there just waiting for their moment.
Dr Tabor
Thanks for your efforts to help during the Waco crisis, and I fully agree that this was complex but botched by the government actors. My comment here is as horrific as that event was, it also led to the heartless terror of the Oklahoma city bombing by a citizen. Since that time it seems to me that the record shows that people are a far greater threat to our lives than the government. Do you feel u.s. society itself is suffering some kind of breakdown and any suggestions about what to do?
Thanks 2380…there are many dimensions to this. I do recommend, from what I have seen so far, the new Paramount/Showtime TV series by the Dowdle brothers, who did the previous mini-series “Waco,” called “Waco: The Aftermath,” covers that very topic…what has sadly happened is that the “Waco Cause” has been taken over to some extent by militant groups who have no interest in the Branch Davidians, or anything they stood for, such as Alex Jones, the current resident Charley Pace, etc. See the recent NYTimes story:
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/24/us/politics/donald-trump-waco-branch-davidians.html
For the Memorial today most of us are not going out to the Waco site for that reason…the official press conference and Memorial will be held in Waco itself.
I am sorry to voice my opinion on this, but I think it is evident that “blaming government alone without citizen’s own self-examination / self-correction / self-improvement” is futile to improve trust in a society.
I think government is like corporation – by nature it is prone to be controlled by relentless/outward/expressive SPIRIT of mankind, not by tender/inner/reserved SOUL of mankind.
In the example of “Shema”, YHWH reveals there are at least 4 parts making up a human – Heart, Soul, Strength (Spirit?), Neighbor (Flesh?)
Careful study of usage of the Hebrew Word “Strength” seems to point to “doing things quickly (aka instant gratification)”. That was one of characteristics of ATF actions during WACO – they seemed to be impatient. They seemed to want vengeance for death of their fellow friends on first day of standoff.
As a Chinese university student who witnessed unfolding of Tiananmen Square in 1989, I am very much surprised to see much higher degree of mistrust between American government and well-armed American people than that between Chinese government and unarmed Chinese people.
I often ponder the reason and conclude that “blaming government alone without citizen’s own self-examination / self-correction / self-improvement” is futile to improve trust in a society.
You are of course welcome to voice your views…why be sorry…I can say here what I said in a previous comment, and I will just repeat:
I have only offered a bare overview in these three posts and the kind of deep digging requires months, even years of work. I have read ALL government reports, and might be, along with Arnold and Wessinger, one of the three or so folks on the planet who have listened to ALL of the 51 days of negotiation tapes…that is where the rubber really meets the road, as to what went on. For me it is not a matter of blame, as much as a singular question…what could have been done and should have been done to resolve this peacefully…and yes, there was alsolutely, an open door to do this…and it was shut. If you want to dig a bit deeper, anyone reading this. watch the 43 hour round table where four of us who have delved the deepest in all areas, talk about the whole thing, from start to finish. It is quite enlightening.
https://youtu.be/s5qw0WlB-aw
Dear Professor, I do appreciate the efforts you and Drs. Arnold and Wessinger put in. I now understand you are not trying to place blame.
I am a student of Book of Revelation, in addition to student of Chinese Philosophy. Rev. 3:7 says “What He opens no one can shut, and what He shuts no one can open.”
I do understand that you are saddened that the door for peaceful resolution at WACO was shut. From your point of view you seem to think “men had shut that door”. I beg to differ. I think someone in Unseen Realm, or in Chinese Philosophy the “Will of Heaven”, had that door shut.
Jesus showed there was a way to work with powers in Unseen Realm. He had demonstrated a way to “convert” these powers into something better with his own human spirit. IMHO Jesus is why moral standards had improved in past ~2000 years, even if not every human would adopt the highest standards of humanity.
Maybe your eyes are shut precisely because you had invested so much energy into every detail of 51 days of WACO. Maybe you can see fingerprints of the “gods” if you look at it from emotional distance.
“As a Chinese university student who witnessed unfolding of Tiananmen Square in 1989, I am very much surprised to see much higher degree of mistrust between American government and well-armed American people than that between Chinese government and unarmed Chinese people.”
Americans have been taught from birth about our revolution to gain independence from the most powerful country in the world at that time. We’re raised to be skeptical of the government and constant right-wing propaganda (aided by foreign governments, including China) destroys trust even more. There are many millions of Americans who think (wrongly) they could defeat the U.S. if necessary.
Vladimir Putin has called American’s obsession with “freedom” (even if many of the proponents of it are highly selective about what that mean) our biggest weakness because it can be exploited and used against us.
Very interesting.
Hello cstu, thanks for your comment. I think the world is a stage, for the ones with eyes/ears to observe/listen and compare and choose wisely for ourselves. We Chinese call this method “foreign wisdom for home use” and “shunning evil while keeping the good” (洋为中用·去芜存菁)
My life path was laid out by my loving Chinese parents prior to coming to the U.S. Then I had freedom for 30 years, to thrive wonderfully and to fail miserably. I have done both, and suffered the consequences for both.
Parents are like heads of household-government in highly patriarchal society. Now as a parent myself I am choosing, wisely, a middle way (中庸之道) for my own child. Jeff Olson, an American author, calls it “freedom on long leash” with his children.
I think in order to enjoy freedom fully while avoiding its trappings, which are many, one must have self-discipline. Just by the uncontrollable eating/obesity problems, a foreigner can easily observe that general American public lacks self-discipline.
Chinese idiom says, “an egg without cracks doesn’t attract flies”. A person or a nation without weaknesses cannot be exploited. IMHO it is more profitable (and easier) to work to eliminate my weaknesses than to prevent others from exploit them.
James, I have listened to many of your references on this sad story, and I commend you and Philip Arnold on your attempt on trying to resolve the situation before April 19 tragic events. Even to read that you/Arnold were able to get Koresh a letter explaining a different perspective on interpreting the Bible, had moved him in your favor is noble.Your last paragraph, “Whatever the truth, the actions by the government on April 19 were inexcusable, particularly given the positive turn in the situation the week before”. Nothing is more compelling than your candid conclusion. Innocent lives were lost recklessly,on both sides, I concur. But the authorities stick to their Federal narrative . This is reality,not to take anything away from your efforts, authorities most of the time,still conclude any action they undertake is justified/needed. Whenever governments move in whatever action directed, no amount of hearings or talks ever conclude it was a mistake. Their actions are,most times, approved by those in power. The Gulf war was another example. No WMD ever found ,yet it was advanced on that notion,and some 300 thousand lives perished. Your empathy on the value of lives is moving.
I’m a big fan of James Tabor (as I am of Bart Ehrman!). I bought the book. Why Waco quite awhile ago. It made me heart sick that the tragedy could have been avoided. If any good came out of it, it’s the new emphasis on defusing training.
https://www.justice.gov/archives/publications/waco/report-deputy-attorney-general-events-waco-texas-role-experts-during-standoff
Some of you might find perusing this material of interest. In my mind, it does show that the FBI depended on a wide range of professional expertise, which was most influential in guiding their decisions. Some of the people James mentions are found here without sharing his perspective – and far more. It also shows some inconsistency following professional guidance – they had more than a few ideas to try to choose from. It is hard to avoid the feeling they thought they were somewhat caught between the proverbial “rock and a hard place”. I cannot honestly echo James’ insistence “that entire fiasco was a disaster from start to finish”, and blame should be mainly dumped on the authorities -Of course, we have total counterclaims on who shoot first in the initial raid, and who started the fire which killed so many, on which so much critically hinged. And maybe just a little “back luck” played a part here.
Thanks for that Frank…it is indeed a vast subject. I have only offered a bare overview in these three posts and the kind of deep digging requires months, even years of work. I have read ALL government reports, and might be, along with Arnold and Wessinger, one of the three or so folks on the planet who have listened to ALL of the 51 days of negotiation tapes…that is where the rubber really meets the road, as to what went on. For me it is not a matter of blame, as much as a singular question…what could have been done and should have been done to resolve this peacefully…and yes, there was alsolutely, an open door to do this…and it was shut. If you want to dig a bit deeper, anyone reading this. watch the 3 hour round table where four of us who have delved the deepest in all areas, talk about the whole thing, from start to finish. It is quite enlightening.
https://youtu.be/s5qw0WlB-aw
I agree. It’s cliché and naïve to blame the authorities. Koresh was caught on tape starting the fire. He murdered his followers out of narcissism. While I appreciate the differing view, the cavalier with which it is proposed is disrespectful to the men and women who worked on and who lost loved ones in this operation. It is also not respectful to the victims of Koresh to portray Koresh as such a logical and reasonable person. Koresh was bedding MANY children and had brainwashed the men in his group into giving up their wives to him. He was likely as insane as Hitler was.
I’ve heard about Waco but did not realise this happened in 1993, when I was in high school. I do remember a big news story about a cult being raided, but had not connected the two. This is presumably because the media reporting at the time was so much at variance with what actually happened, being largely a conflation of multiple unrelated cults, that the one was unrecognisable from the other. (I’m in Australia, so our journalists may have had their wires even more crossed than the American ones.)
Fascinating stuff Dr. Tabor. Thank you and thank you Dr. Ehrman for putting this up. I’ve studied the Waco incident for years concerning different aspects of it as far as the blowback of it later and NEVER have I ever known this. Put’s some new box cars in the train of thought for sure.
Informative!! I grew up only a few miles from their community. We were a very small rural community and knew of the religious group. There were a few children and teenagers that attend our little small 1a school. Everyone knew everyone, and didn’t think anything odd of their beliefs. Everyone in this Baptist community assumed they were teaching the Seventh-day Adventist theology. Having been in the community since the late 50’s it was just a normal thing, nothing odd stood out. There were very devout followers, and there were some that IMO were there just to feed a sense of belonging, rather than a religious connection. Being a very small school of only 25-30 kids in each grade you had no choice but to become close to the Branch Davidians in your class (which this term “Branch Davidian” was never used around town). It was sad tragedy that happened, as we lost 2 of our classmates in the fire. I still say, and always will the ATF went about this all wrong, David was always at a gas station (Turners) in town, he could have been arrested anytime.
I don’t think it’s right to omit the evidence that Koresh started the fire. He was caught on audiotape that is available on Youtube directing his followers to spread fuel and hey around the compound the day before the fire. While I appreciate that this author wants to offer their chops as a Biblical interpreter to shed wisdom on the internal machinations of such a cult, there is a potentially fatal and naïve assumption underlying the entire argument. Tabor assumes that Koresh is an individual who acts consistently within a logical framework which he honestly and truthfully divulges to his followers. I think we need to take a step back and acknowledge that we’re talking about a man who was marrying and bedding 12 year olds, who had effectively brainwashed his male followers into giving up their wives to him, whom he was also bedding, all the while preaching a fiery gospel of coming destruction. Why should anyone believe that this man wasn’t a megalomaniacal narcissist who simply murdered his followers so that they would die in this state of perfect adoration and admiration for himself. He wanted to kill them while he controlled them so they’d never leave him.
I want to add a few things after my previous comment… First, this series is really well done. There are some excellent points here. I also want to thank Dr. James Tabor for providing a link to his roundtable discussion with four religious studies scholars on this – that was especially enlightening. Still – I have to say I find some of the statements here a little disingenuous. You stated above that “the survivors say that the FBI started the fire”. Well, that’s not true. I just watched the Australian 60 minutes interview with Graeme Craddock, one of the 9 people who survived the fire. Graeme denies that Koresh took “little children” as brides but admits he took “underage girls” as brides, and says he still believes that Koresh is the Messiah, and hopes that Koresh will return. Yet, Graeme says that he say Davidians pouring fuel and saying “light the fire”. Also, you mention that the Davidians say that Koresh wouldn’t have committed suicide but Koresh and his right-hand-man were found both dead with gunshot wounds to the head in a suicide manner. Why would you make these statements without acknowledging this evidence, or even at all?