I’ve long been interested in thinking about how to make boring subjects interesting. I’ve become especially attuned to the issue recently as I’ve begun to read a lot more scholarship in fields completely unrelated to mine. Some scholars have a gift in being able to reach low level mortals like me. My own field is not nearly as complicated as the hard sciences (always hard for me, at least!) but every field has its technicalities and jargon and wide range of not-widely-shared assumptions, perspectives, and history of investigation.
And so I was struck when I ran across this post from some years ago, and realized that it’s still the sort of thing I think about roughly every day.
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The difficulty in presenting serious scholarship to a lay audience is how to make something that can be very dry and technical and detailed and, well, boring to most human beings actually interesting and lively and thought provoking. It is obviously quite easy to make something interesting dull. University professors are unusually skilled at doing that. So too, even more oddly, are authors of college-level textbooks. But frankly, I’ve never understood why. My guess is that most people have never put any thought into how to make something interesting, probably because they think that if *they* find it inherently interesting, it must be inherently interesting – so why go to the bother of trying to *make* it interesting.
That, in my view, is a big mistake. And I’m extremely lucky that I realized it was a mistake already when I was a nineteen-year-old.
At that time I was a third-year student at Moody Bible Institute, and my roommate and I had decided that we wanted to work as youth pastors in a church. Moody set us up with a great church (I still have very fond memories) in Oak Lawn – a southern suburb of Chicago. We would go there on Wednesday evenings, and then on Saturday evenings, spend the night, and spend all of Sunday there. We led prayer meetings, Bible studies, retreats, social gatherings – all the sorts of things that youth pastors do. It was a lively and active group of high school and college-age young people; we got along great with them; and it was a kind of golden age for both the church and us.
But it was in that context that I realized that nothing is, in fact, inherently interesting. At the time I was completely passionate about the Bible. But as I started teaching Bible studies to 15-year olds, I realized that despite my own enthusiasm the material was decidedly not inherently interesting. It had to be *made* interesting. And that took a lot of doing.
Part of it involved showing how something from the Bible was of immediate and real importance to someone’s life – either how they behaved or how they thought about the world, themselves, God, or whatever. Studying the Bible, with these kids, could not simply involve history lessons about antiquity!
But communicating was more than simply trying to be relevant. My roommate, Bill, was unusually skilled at telling anecdotes about his past and making them relate to a spiritual insight or religious idea. It took me a long time, but I figured out how to do that myself. And that was the start of things for me. It is important to give people something to relate to, something interesting, something out of the ordinary, and help them see how it is significant in itself and how it can make something else interesting.
Years later I was an established scholar with three books under my belt, all of them technical studies of aspects of the Greek manuscript tradition of the New Testament. There was no need to make this kind of study interesting to anyone other than scholars. I was writing for scholars, and they already *knew* why these kinds of studies mattered.
But then my editor at Oxford University Press asked me if I would consider writing a textbook on the New Testament for college undergraduates. I had never ever planned to do something like that. Quite the contrary, my plan was to be a scholar who wrote for scholars till the day I died. So I said no. She asked again. I said no. She asked again. And by now I had been thinking about it. I absolutely loved lecturing to 19-20 year olds. Communication was one of my real pleasures, not at all like the hard, rigorous, blood-and-sweat work of producing a scholarly monograph. Maybe it would be fun to write a textbook incorporating my skills of communication in a different medium.
I agreed to do it, and it changed everything for me. After the textbook was a trade book. And then I was set for life. Now I write all three kinds of books: scholarly monographs, textbooks, trade books. Each has a different audience. And each one requires a different kind of communication skill. I learned already as a 19-year old youth pastor, myself, that the audience is everything, and to communicate does not simply mean to shovel out information. It means figuring out how to make that information interesting. Since it is – at least to me!
And tonight I get to try it again, with a lecture on how the New Testament appears to contain forgeries.
I get what you are saying, but wouldn’t you say that half of the ‘interestingness’ equation comes from the ‘student’. For me, nothing is uninteresting. I routinely study outside my field to the point where I’m not even sure what my ‘field’ is anymore. I have read your scholarly works, and find them to be completely readable and understandable, but of course I take the time to review your references and think about what you are saying. However, I gave myself a background in this field because I found it fascinating. I have yet to find a subject in which I can’t find something interesting embedded. I even enjoy talking to attorneys and negotiating federal contracts! I even ran for political office as a blue candidate in a deeply red district, knowing I would lose, just so I could find out firsthand what that was like. In my view, the only people who find something in any field uninteresting are themselves uninteresting people.
Ah, I’d say you’re unusual. And lucky! Most of us find LOTS of things uninteresting, until we find a *reason* to be interested. I’ve never ever been interested in anatomy, astrophysics, or evolutiounary psychology — until the past few years, when I’ve begun to find them absorbing. So good on ya! May your tribe increase!
Ha! You are the first person I know who can quote from Abou Ben Adhem! Surely that was not part of your curriculum of study for NT history, was it? I learned it in 6th grade…
I’m not sure I knew where it literally caeme from just that it was based on Deuteronomy 1:11 . So thanks!
In case you haven’t looked it up already:
https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/44433/abou-ben-adhem
Abou Ben Adhem (may his tribe increase!)
Awoke one night from a deep dream of peace,
And saw, within the moonlight in his room,
Making it rich, and like a lily in bloom,
An angel writing in a book of gold:—
Exceeding peace had made Ben Adhem bold,
And to the presence in the room he said,
“What writest thou?”—The vision raised its head,
And with a look made of all sweet accord,
Answered, “The names of those who love the Lord.”
“And is mine one?” said Abou. “Nay, not so,”
Replied the angel. Abou spoke more low,
But cheerly still; and said, “I pray thee, then,
Write me as one that loves his fellow men.”
The angel wrote, and vanished. The next night
It came again with a great wakening light,
And showed the names whom love of God had blest,
And lo! Ben Adhem’s name led all the rest.
Thanks!
Dr. Ehrman. I’m sorry to keep bugging you. I’m watching a lecture you did on heaven and hell. I know some Christians say Jesus wasn’t an apocalyptic prophet. What do we do in the gospel of John when Jesus to seems to say the kingdom of god is within believers.
I also get stuck on eternal conscious torment with 2 Thes 1:9. All of this is just difficult.
I discuss this at some length in my book Heaven and Hell. One of the most fascinating features of the traditions of Jesus’ sayings is how they come to be “de-apocalypticized” over time. Line up the Gospels chronologically (starting even with Gospel sources) (: the earliest show Jesus as strongly apocalyptic in his proclamation (Q, Mark, M, L); then less so starting with Luke, then almost not at all with John. When you get to Thomas, he is *anti*-apocalyptic! As time goes on, people are less interested in Jesus declaring that the end is coming very soon, within his own generation.
I will check your book out. That makes sense. That’s why I wonder why current evangelicals focus on the gospel of John so much. They’re like the gospel of John is the true meaning of what Jesus was saying. With kingdom being inside his followers.
There’s no way to really prove Q exists right? I’m still wondering about goodacre’s case against Q. I guess we’ll never know.
Right — it can’t be proved either way. Most scholars except for Goodacre and his disciples — all of whom are reaching a wider public — continue to think that Q is the least problematic solution, and there is very good evidence for it. But it’s not the kind of thing that can be *proved* in the way that you can pretty well prove that, say, the Gospel of Matthew exists.
Even though the historical Jesus didn’t believe in heaven as the place you want to go to immediately after death, do the Synoptics reflect a belief in such a heaven? John does, right?
Luke does in Jesus’ words to the person being crucified wiht him, and John does. So it starts showing up when the apocalytpic expectatons of an imminent resurrection begin to fade.
You certainly have the gift of making dry subjects fascinating, Dr Ehrman. I read Misquoting Jesus very quickly and thoroughly enjoyed it. Anxious to read more on the same subject I bought a similar book by another author but couldn’t finish it. I tried to work out why your book hit the spot and could only conclude that it was your enthusiasm for the subject together with just the right amount of detail and a carefully constructed narrative. But whatever your secret is, please keep doing what you do 🙂
Thanks! I had to work especially hard with that one!
Hello Bart,
Here’s a link to an interesting article about how the recent restoration of Da Vinci’s Last Supper shows what Leonardo put on the table for Passover. Pass the tartar sauce please.
The Strange Dish Depicted In Leonardo Da Vinci’s The Last Supper
Leonardo Da Vinci’s painting isn’t a historically accurate Passover spread, which includes a seafood dish that gives more insight into his own eating habits.
Read in Tasting Table: https://apple.news/A34hHyiq1RYmcT6LJGt1_Xg
Best,
Kurt
Interesting. Well, if you’ve got a bunch of fishermen over for dinner….
Prof, you said “the New Testament appears ”. Has some of your outside reading been accounting/auditing? You know how to distinguish an auditor from a consultant? Just ask him any question. If he says “it appears” he’s an auditor; if he says “it depends” he’s a comsultant!
Ha!
Dr. Ehrman, your books have done an excellent job in making this stuff interesting and got me interested in this subject in a way that I wasn’t previously. My schedule is so busy that I don’t have time to do stuff like take your online class about Moses and so on. I hope you’ll write a popular book that covers the stuff in this course, perhaps you can title it “Misquoting Moses”. I’d definitely purchase a copy for myself. Thanks for all your hard work popularizing this stuff.
Got it! You can watch the courses at your leisure if you get it, but opoh boy to I understand about not having any….
I remember a while ago you mentioned that writing a popular-level book could be career suicide for any but the most prominent (and tenured) professors in academia. Along with making things interesting, do you think that this stigma attached to writing for us “untouchables” is hurting academia in the long term? For instance, wouldn’t popular opinion on scientific (or Biblical) issues be left wide open for people to fill with information that was…to be charitable..not necessarily well-informed or honest? Isn’t that what’s happened, to a large extent?
I think what is hurting the academy right now, at least in the Humanities (where history, religion, philosophy, English, literature, etc. house themselves), is that experts have become so technicalized and theorized that they pursue things that no one in the general public is much interested in, rather than the traditional topics they are. Very few general readers are that interested in a Derridean reading of Romans or a Lacanian reading of Genesis or a queer approach to Hamlet. Many of us academics VERY MUCH are. But if we disdain the bigger more general issues that the public is intrigued by still (does Paul’s letter to the Romans contradict the teachings of Jesus? What in Genesis might be reliable? What is Hamlet all about?) insisting that these issues are below anyone’s dignity even to consider, and that the public *ought* to be interested in Derrida and Lacan (if you don’t know who they are, that’s more or less my point), then why should the public want to *fund* us? It’s not like we’re solveing the problems of climate change and cancer….