Loading...In my previous post I began to describe the Jewish apocryphal book 1 Enoch, the only apocryphon clearly quoted in the New Testament, and apparently quoted as an authoritative Scripture (Jude 14-15). Here I pick up where I left off, describing what the opening section of the book, the “Book of the Watchers” is all about. The apocalyptic strain of the book is here obvious from the outset.
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After a short poem the author launches directly into his account of the coming judgment by describing a future theophany to (literally) end all theophanies.
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Dear Dr Ehrman
This is a rather odd comment, and so I beg your pardon in advance. You may recall that, a number of months ago, I posed a question regarding John 16:15, and whether it may be seen as original to the Gospel. You, very kindly, replied stating that is is overwhelmingly seen as original to the text of John, despite being occasionally absent due to homoioteleuton. If I may ask two, final questions regarding this:
1-Does this remain your considered opinion, as a textual critic and colleague of the late Bruce Metzger ?
2-Would you recommend any academic treatments regarding homoioteleuton in New Testament Manuscripts?
Do you mean have I changed my mind since you last asked the question? Nope. It was always Metzger’s view as well.
There probably are lengthier treatments, but for all such questoins you might start with Metzger’s discussion in his classic The Text of the New Testament.
Thank you Dr Ehrman. Fascinating. I think 1 Enoch is often cited by the ancient alien ‘lobby’ as ‘evidence’ of early interaction between primitive humans and an advanced race of some type. In the above extract, there seems to be some reference to passing on military technology to mankind. I also believe (if my memory is correct) that when Enoch completes his journey to ‘Heaven’ and returns to Earth, his former companions had aged more than him. I think this is reasonably in line with Einsteinian physics (relativity etc) assuming Enoch travelled in some kind of space ship capable of Star Trek like speeds. Naturally, the ancient alien lobby have a field day with such material. But it is curious nonetheless.
Do you think Revelation 20 was derived from 1st Enoch?
I doubt it. These were common motifs in Jewish apocalyptic literature (and then Christian)
Hello Bart/Dr Ehrman
You have said many times that The Apocalypse of Peter just missed out on being included in the Bible and that it nearly got in instead of Revelation.
My question Bart is how could such a book like The Apocalypse of Peter get so close to being included in the bible seen as it undoubtedly describes and teaches eternal torment for the unsaved when the rest of the Bible teaches that the lost will be destroyed annihilated, melt away ,cut off ,perish ,die,be no more etc
Thanks.
Ah, it didn’t get in for precisely the opposite reason. The ORIGINAL form of the Apocalypse of Peter, in the passage you’re referring to, as found in the oldest surviving Greek fragment of the text, taught UNIVERSAL salvation. That’s why the fathers decided it could not be scripture. (And it’s why later scribes altered the passage) I have a (rather detailed, in-the-weeds) full discussion of that in my boook Journeys to Heaven and Hell, ch. 7. (The church fathers, btw, typically did believe in eternal torment, though the NT does not; that too is in my book)
Hello Bart/Dr Ehrman
Some people believe their is prove that the idea of an afterlife came from the Old Testament, such as Matthew 22, Mark 12, and Luke 20 where the Sadducees approach Jesus seeking to test Him with a question about the afterlife. Notice how Jesus corrects the Sadducees by quoting from Exodus 3:6: “You are in error because you do not know the Scriptures or the power of God…But in the account of the burning bush, even Moses showed that the dead rise, for he calls the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”
What are we to make of these explanations?
Thanks.
Most interpreters see this as a highly unusual understanding of the passage by Jesus — it was not interpreted that way by most Jewish readers that we know of.
I would just like to point out that if anyone wishes to read the Nickelsburg/VanderKam translation of The Book of Enoch (reflecting all the surviving Aramaic, Greek & Ge’ez manuscripts) and can’t swing the pricey two volume critical edition, the fine folks at Fortress Press (Hermeneia) have published an inexpensive edition ($20 bucks American!) with a nice introduction and notes to the text. May their generations be blessed! (I wish all the academic presses realized there’s a lay audience for this stuff. Brill? De Gruyter? Are you listening?)
Oh, they listen and hear. In fact, they hear it *all* the time!
Off topic –
Prayer to Zeus
O Zeus, Father and King,
lord of sky and thunder,
watcher over mortals and gods alike,
I lift my voice to You in these days of money, power, and death.
Guard us against the chains of distraction.
Teach us not to bow before riches or false crowns.
I pray You look upon our public servants—
that they may act with justice,
that they may remember the weight of their oath,
that they may serve not greed, but the good of all.
Guide us, O Olympian,
that our hearts may not be led astray.
For what matters is not silver nor gold,
but the footprints of Your heart in ours,
the divine mark that whispers of truth, of courage, of honor.
And I pray for the vulnerable,
for those who cannot protect themselves.
Let Your thunder shield them,
let Your wisdom raise them,
let Your strength dwell within them.
O Zeus, let us not forget.
Amidst the storms of this world,
let us walk with You.
So let it be.
So the earth is destroyed, but the earth is still here. How exactly does that work?
The earth is destroyed and everyone dies, but the earth is still here and everyone, that is the righteous, have a pretty good time of things. How is this logical?
“Earth destroyed” in this context does not mean that the planet itself is smashed into smithereens, but that the world as we know it is done away with for a new world (here on this planet) to appear.
This might be a simple question, but why do you think Second Temple Judaism was so very apocalyptic?
It started probably during the Maccabean revolt where observant Jews in Israel were suffering horribly for retainly the laws nad customs (circumcistion, sabbath observance, kashrut, etc.) for striving to obey God. Some of them realized their suffering wasn’t coming from God as a punishment, since it came from *obeying* him. That made them reason that there must be powers in the world opposed to God and his people, which led to the apocalyptic views.
Dear Bart, With the resurfacing of Enoch in 1829 later revised by R. H. Charles, we’ve noticed many of its verses in the books of Revelation and Daniel. The NT writers don’t seem to care about the genre of the literature they quote. It has been more about reframing the message. The NT isn’t going to quote statements regarding 10 heavens and Metatron but will deal with judgment and exaltation. This art of literary borrowing and reshaping the narrative is nearly entirely throughout Scripture. Thanks for your wonderful work. Tom Roberts, PhD, DD BYU New Testament Commentary Contributor
Hello Dr.Bart Erhman
Was early christianity very diverse in the liturgical landscape, from my understanding many of the early christians where Jews some where Romans and some Greek. Some spoke Latin, koine Greek and others Aramic but my religion History teacher claims that universaly all the church meeting where held in Greek until the 3.century. I suppose he is wrong on this on.
All our records certainly are in Greek; the problem is knowing how those in one locale or another spoke in their worship services since only the educated urban folk probalby spoke Greek.
“indictment against those who have violated it, that is, the fallen angels. Their disobedience will lead to disastrous results.”
“Yes, the issue of omniscience is very difficult to figure out, given how God reacts to failure in the Bible.”
I read the Code of Hammurabi in high school thinking that was blasphemous!
Since I’ve learnt many of the NT life principles are from Greek Philosophers.
Thanks!
Prof. Ehrman! What do you think of the argument that Luke’s genealogy of 77 generations was meant to convey the nearness of the parousia because Luke might have known the book of Enoch’s “70 generations till the end,” and Enoch was depicted as writing from the perspective of the 7th generation which would make Jesus’ generation the 77th! It is also obvious that Luke copied his list of generations from the O.T. but added 4 generations to his list to make his generations total 77. See this short piece online: https://www.livius.org/sources/content/bible/lukes-seventy-seven-generations/
I doubt if Luke would have known 1 Enoch; does this author provide any reasons for thinking he did? I can’t remember: in Enoch’s genealogy is it counting “God” as the first? I think you need him to be for Luke’s to add up to 77? My general sense is that 77 would be a useful number because of it’s obvious relation to the perfect number itself.