Steefen:
Who are the Ancient Mesopotamians in art engravings with wings
ChatGPT said:
ChatGPT
The winged figures in Ancient Mesopotamian art are typically representations of divine or supernatural beings, often associated with gods, kings, and protective spirits. These figures are prominently featured in Assyrian, Babylonian, and Sumerian art. Here are some key examples:
1. Lamassu – a winged creature with the bearded head of a human and the body of a bull or a lion.
The Lamassu is one of the most famous winged figures in Mesopotamian art. It is a protective deity, often depicted as a hybrid creature with the body of a bull or lion, the wings of an eagle, and a human head. Lamassu figures were commonly placed at the entrances of palaces and city gates to guard against evil forces.
2. Cherubim or Winged Genii
These figures, known as apkallu (in Akkadian), were often depicted as human-like figures with wings. They were considered protective spirits or supernatural beings, serving the gods or kings. In many depictions, these winged genii are shown holding objects like buckets and pinecones, symbols of purification or fertility. They were believed to bless and protect the king or temple.
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while Anu, Enlil, and Enki are major gods in Mesopotamian mythology, they were generally not depicted with wings in engravings or other forms of art.
It is generally thought amongst scholars of Hebrew that the Apkullu are the source for the figures of the Watchers in Genesis 6.
Aramaic עִיר ʿiyr, plural עִירִין ʿiyrin, [ʕiːr(iːn)]; Theodotian trans: ir; from the root of Heb. ʿer, “awake, watchful”; Greek: ἐγρήγοροι, transl.: egrḗgoroi; “Watchers”, “those who are awake”; “guard”, “watcher”
Divine figures, part of Yahweh’s heavenly court. “Sons of God”, later, angels. Not aliens.
7 fishmen turn into 200 angels/Watchers w2ho want human wives
7 sons of the God Enki.
Hebrew myth shouldn’t usurp Mesopotamian myth.
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Did the apkullu take human wives?
ChatGPT said:
ChatGPT
In ancient Mesopotamian mythology, the apkallu (or abkallu) were semi-divine beings associated with wisdom, often depicted as fish-clad sages sent by the gods to instruct humanity in various arts, sciences, and knowledge. They are typically connected to the god Ea (Enki), the god of wisdom and water, and are seen as protectors and advisers to kings and humanity.
While the apkallu are not usually depicted as marrying human women in the traditional myths, later texts and traditions suggest some form of union between divine or semi-divine beings and humans. In particular, the post-diluvian apkallu—descendants of the original pre-flood sages—are sometimes referred to as partially human, suggesting a blending of divine and human lineages.
In later traditions and influenced by biblical parallels (such as the story of the Nephilim in the Hebrew Bible, where divine beings take human wives), some scholars speculate that this motif may have influenced ideas about divine-human unions in the region. However, there is no widespread or explicit story within surviving Mesopotamian texts that directly claims that the apkallu took human wives. Their primary role was as wise instructors, helping humanity with practical and spiritual guidance.
Some members of the Hebrew God’s heavenly court are 1) part like sons of Man and 2) part fish.
And Stephen, the Hebrew variation you’re sharing has the number jumpint from 7 to 200.
! ! ! Hebrew myth shouldn’t usurp Mesopotamian myth. ! ! !
Did the Apkullu impart wisdom to Abram (Abraham) or something?
So you and your Hebrew scholars are way more than doubling the original 7 Apkullu.
You don’t have a problem with that. Really?
From a Master’s thesis avaible online —
The Origins of Jewish Apocalyptic Literature: Prophecy, Babylon, and 1 Enoch
Sarah Robinson
University of South Florida
** you do not have permission to see this link **
This table compares the figures of the Babylonian Apkallu and the Hebrew Watchers. The point being that one is derived in some sense from the other. See the body of the text for a discussion.
Table 1: The Apkallu’s and the Watchers
1. The apkallu’s are described as the sons of the god Ea.
The watchers are described as “the sons of heaven”.
2. The apkallu’s had two primary functions:
* They were the guardians of the cosmic order.
* They were the servants in Marduk’s temple.
The function of the watchers is described in the same way:
* They are put in charge of the cosmic order.
* They are servants in the heavenly temple.
3. In primeval time both the watchers and the apkallu’s visited the earth.
4. Both the watchers and the apkallu’s taught men wisdom and skills.
5. The watchers mixed sexually with human women. This is not explicitly
stated about the apkallu’s. The sources seem, however, to presuppose a
sexual mingling, since the latest apkallu is a mixture of apkallu and
ordinary human being.
6. The watchers rebelled against the divine order. Some of the apkallu’s
offended the gods.
7. The watchers were condemned to the nether world at the same time of
of the flood. The apkallu’s were dispatched to the nether world at the same
time.
8. The Watcher story reflects the practice of invoking underworld divinites
for magical purposes. The apkallu’s were invoked for the same purpose.
NOTE: Using the apostrophe “s” does not denote possession. Apparently it is the convention when using foreign words like “apakullu” as plurals. Ugly looking though.
I mean the reason the history of God’s humanity goes back around 6000 years is because the history of writing goes back 6,000 years. The place with no rain but groundwater is Eridu the world’s first city, that land looks like Mars.
These stories are absolutely carried by Mesopotamianized nomads into colonial Canaan as the the Mesopotamianized Amorites, the Hyksos.
The key point in the land claim though is they aren’t given a whole property sea to desert, in this period its more usual that you are just given towns within the area.
i’m mot sure the various divine councils like Annunaki and Elohim are exact equivalents though, because here they use local gods to represent the local land claim.
Ramses, for example is depicted as Baal Saphon-El. Baal Saphon, the Lord of the Mountain like Shaddai, is the Lord of Canaan. The mountain is the boundary landmark of the entrance of Canaan. While El is the Supreme God of the Levant. So he’s essentially making a land claim the local people would know of Canaan, Levant.
Dear Bart,
author of
Misquoting Jesus, Jesus Interrupted, and Forgery and Counterforgery
People who hold the HOLY BIBLE dear to their hearts read your books to be careful about taking the HOLY BIBLE at face value.
With our Lord and Savior of the World, Jesus Christ reading from HOLY SCRIPTURES in the gospels and with Jesus saying not a letter of the law will disappear (Matthew 5:18, Luke 16:17, Isaiah 40:8, Psalm 119:89, 119: 160, Romans 3:31, Galatians 3:17-18, etc.), we come to you earnestly and carefully not to lose our Christianity and belief in God about this issue of carefully holding the HOLY BIBLE at face value, dear to our hearts.
So, Christians have to come to terms about Gilgamesh and the Hebrew account of Noah.
Christians also have to come to terms about Atrahasis, another Sumerian account that includes the genesis of humans being bioengineering which has been verified by Science (Greg Braden and Lloyd Pye).
You care about the efficacy of scripture. As most Christians own a Bible and cherish it, and since people think God is a god of truth, people should know about New Testament criticism, Sumerian epics, and science?
** you do not have permission to see this link **..ent-169576
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Bart’s reply:
Yes, people should know about everything important. Would that it were possible!
Here’s another reply from sLiu that I do not quite understand:
I wonder how much I’m not that FUNDAMENTALIST I still proclaim.
Maybe I ought to put into an Ai: how am I a hypocrite: before fundamentalist right accepting morality [Witness Lee],…now
Tour Bus Discussion about the Anunna (Sumerian Name for Anunnaki) and What Genesis Does Not Tell Us about: The Younger Dryas (12,900 to 11,700 years ago)
The tour bus is in Van [pronounced Von], Turkey.
YouTube Channel: Matthew LaCroix
Video: Ancient Civilizations & Nature of Reality FULL Lecture | Matthew LaCroix, Paul Wallis
Steefen:
I enjoy the format of this video because I remember tour bus trips that I liked.
The discussion in Q&A format is good.
Let us know your thoughts about the civilizations not discussed in the book of Genesis.
Thank you.
Steefen’s YouTube Comment on This Video:
You speak of Haldi, but when I googled Haldi, I’m getting “the supreme god of war” and a chief deity of the Kingdom of Ararat. Moments earlier, you said war was not the point. Pls. clarify. And Haldi is supposed to be under Anu?
Second, Atra-hasis gives us 7 males and 7 females for human creation. Adapa was not one of them. If so, Adapa is Adam or one of the 7 first men does not work. Please explain this, also. Thank you,
Enki and Ninhursaĝa
In this major creation myth, Enki lives in the paradise land of Dilmun.
Steefen
Really.
Enki and Ninhursaĝa
He seduces various goddesses (his daughters and granddaughters), leading to the birth of several deities and plants. His wife Ninhursaĝa curses him after he eats eight specific plants that grew from her essence.
Enki falls ill in eight body parts, one of which is the rib.
The Sumerian word for rib is “ti,” which also means “to make live”.
Ninhursaĝa eventually relents and creates eight healing goddesses,
including Ninti, the “Lady of the Rib” or “Lady Who Makes Live”.
This narrative has striking similarities to the story of Eve being created from Adam’s rib.
Conceptual parallels.
BDEhrman
FreedomBen
evgendob
Robert
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