Ralph Ellis wrote: Pa-seba-khen-nuit
Pa means My
Seba means Star
Kha means Rises [over]/Shines [on]
n means His
Nuit means City
Wikipedia wrote: Pa-seba-kha-en-niut: the star appearing in the city.
First, I would like to correct Ralph Ellis’ spelling of city.
In Decoding Egyptian Hieroglyphs: How to Read the Secret Language of the Pharaohs by Bridget McDermott, (Chronicle Books, San Francisco, 2001), on page 166, city is not nuit, it is niwt.
Second, I would like to correct Ralph Ellis’ mention that n means his.
In Decoding Egyptian Hieroglyphs: How to Read the Secret Language of the Pharaohs, Chapter 5: Reference File, Pronouns, p. 155-156, “n” never means his: “f” means his; “n” means we, us, our.
Third, I would like to correct Ralph Ellis’ use of Pa for my.
The lower case i is my (Ibid, ps 155 and 169).
So, the dead rise over our city? Perhaps. There seems to be a fascination with the living dead. All the mentions of the Rephaim seem to suggest death cults. Certainly the mainstream Egyptian cults might have been changed a little as practiced by those in southern Canaan.
What is the source for this “official title” of David? I am finding only forums and such.
Also, many kings (and people in general) had names with fantastical meanings. I am not sure where David’s outlandish names leads us.
FocusMyView said
So, the dead rise over our city? Perhaps. There seems to be a fascination with the living dead. All the mentions of the Rephaim seem to suggest death cults. Certainly the mainstream Egyptian cults might have been changed a little as practiced by those in southern Canaan.What is the source for this “official title” of David? I am finding only forums and such.
Also, many kings (and people in general) had names with fantastical meanings. I am not sure where David’s outlandish names leads us.
The dead rise over our city?
What are you talking about?
The name is something to the effect of: The Star Rises on the City.
** you do not have permission to see this link **
Here is a website with 5 names of Psusennes. See the last one (birth name).
** you do not have permission to see this link **
I am trying to see the correlations. Certainly I am positing these were composite characters, so there are characteristics of different rulers used to make the legendary king David. Or maybe he was just a Outcast (Apiru) leader who at some time conquered Jerusalem. The fact that the bible puts a Solomon in between David and the rest of his lineage that we see mentioned in the Mesha stele just confuses things.
So one characteristic of the composite of David is the star of David. Is this what connects David to this Egyptian pharaoh or are there other similarities? I am not sure when the star of David became associated with David or Jerusalem or Israel, tbh. ** you do not have permission to see this link ** confirms this. There are various jewelry sites that are selling pendants and such that do promote a Star of David being from the 11th century codex Leningrad or much earlier, but nothing scholarly that I can find.
I am completely at ease with the characters Saul, David and Solomon being rewrites of Egyptian pharaohs by the Dt historian, I really am. I am also at ease with characters like Joseph and Abraham and especially Moses being rewrites of Egyptian heroes.
Is there anything else that ties a pharaoh to David now that we know that the star of david, in talking about ancient Israel, is anachronistic?
FocusMyView said
I am trying to see the correlations. Certainly I am positing these were composite characters, so there are characteristics of different rulers used to make the legendary king David. Or maybe he was just a Outcast (Apiru) leader who at some time conquered Jerusalem. The fact that the bible puts a Solomon in between David and the rest of his lineage that we see mentioned in the Mesha stele just confuses things.
So one characteristic of the composite of David is the star of David. Is this what connects David to this Egyptian pharaoh or are there other similarities? I am not sure when the star of David became associated with David or Jerusalem or Israel, tbh. ** you do not have permission to see this link ** confirms this. There are various jewelry sites that are selling pendants and such that do promote a Star of David being from the 11th century codex Leningrad or much earlier, but nothing scholarly that I can find.
I am completely at ease with the characters Saul, David and Solomon being rewrites of Egyptian pharaohs by the Dt historian, I really am. I am also at ease with characters like Joseph and Abraham and especially Moses being rewrites of Egyptian heroes.
Is there anything else that ties a pharaoh to David now that we know that the star of david, in talking about ancient Israel, is anachronistic?
Are you sure there is no mention of City of David or Star of David in the Old Testament?
FocusMyView said
So one characteristic of the composite of David is the star of David. Is this what connects David to this Egyptian pharaoh or are there other similarities? I am not sure when the star of David became associated with David or Jerusalem or Israel, tbh.
** you do not have permission to see this link ** confirms this. There are various jewelry sites that are selling pendants and such that do promote a Star of David being from the 11th century codex Leningrad or much earlier, but nothing scholarly that I can find.
Please remember the last word in the pharaoh’s name: city.
It is not just star but star and city.
= = =
23rd Psalm Star City Daughter (4 planks to the argument and counting)
David’s Daughter-in-Law was Tamar, Maachah-Tamar I and a Granddaughter was named Maachah-Tamar II
Now, Absalom [third son of David, mother: Maacah] had erected for himself a marble pillar in the king’s dale, two furlongs distant from Jerusalem, which he named Absalom’s Hand, saying that if his children were killed, his name would remain by that pillar; for he had three sons and one daughter named Tamar…
Antiquities, Book 7, Chapter 10, Section 3, 243
… [Rehoboam, son and successor of Solomon] married a woman of his own kindred, and had by her three children born to him. He married also another of his own kindred, who was a daughter of Absalom by Tamar whose name was Maachah; and by her he had a son whom he named Abijah. He had moreover many other children by other wives, but he loved Maachah above them all.
Antiquities, Book 8, Chapter 10, Section 1, 249
Meaning:
Absalom had one daughter named Tamar, but also named Maachah; hence Maahah-Tamar II. Step-brother Solomon had a son named Rehoboam. Rehoboam married his father’s step-brother’s daughter Maachah-Tamar II and had a son named Abijah.
Psusennes’ daughter Maat-ka-re/ra Mutemhat/Mu-Tamhat
Name of Psusenne’s daughter: Maat-Ka-Ra Mu-Tamhat
Name of David’s granddaughter: Maa-chah Tamar (II)
Changing the name from Egyptian to Hebrew, the Egyptian God Re/Ra is removed.
Pick up at Chapter V: Pharaoh Psusennes, p. 75
Correction: Maachah-Tamar I would be David’s wife before Bathsheba, so I’m changing the I and II below to II and III.
23rd Psalm Star City Daughter (4 planks to the argument and counting)
David’s Daughter-in-Law was Tamar, Maachah-Tamar II and a Granddaughter was named Maachah-Tamar III
Now, Absalom [third son of David, mother: Maacah] had erected for himself a marble pillar in the king’s dale, two furlongs distant from Jerusalem, which he named Absalom’s Hand, saying that if his children were killed, his name would remain by that pillar; for he had three sons and one daughter named Tamar…
Antiquities, Book 7, Chapter 10, Section 3, 243
… [Rehoboam, son and successor of Solomon] married a woman of his own kindred, and had by her three children born to him. He married also another of his own kindred, who was a daughter of Absalom by Tamar whose name was Maachah; and by her he had a son whom he named Abijah. He had moreover many other children by other wives, but he loved Maachah above them all.
Antiquities, Book 8, Chapter 10, Section 1, 249
Meaning:
Absalom had one daughter named Tamar, but also named Maachah; hence Maahah-Tamar III. Step-brother Solomon had a son named Rehoboam. Rehoboam married his father’s step-brother’s daughter Maachah-Tamar III and had a son named Abijah.
Psusennes’ daughter Maat-ka-re/ra Mutemhat/Mu-Tamhat
Name of Psusenne’s daughter: Maat-Ka-Ra Mu-Tamhat
Name of David’s granddaughter: Maa-chah Tamar (III)
Changing the name from Egyptian to Hebrew, the Egyptian God Re/Ra is removed.
Steefen said
Saul was fighting the Philistines.Saul lost that battle.
Saul’s son Ishbaal, at age 40, became king of Israel (2nd Sam. 2: 10)
Ishbaal was killed.
David became king of Israel (2nd Sam. chapter 5)
Chapter 5: 17-25 David defeats the Philistines.
Ralph
Although the biblical texts like to imply that King David simply succeeded to the Israelite monarchy upon the death of King Saul [not true given the above], Josephus is equally adamant that King David had to mount a major military campaign in the region to secure his rule there.
The campaign lists which were inscribed in the Temple of Karnak by Sheshonq I [King Solomon] were mainly listing the military campaigns of his father, Psusennes II [King David].
Josephus expands on the reputed extent of Solomon’s empire by indicating that he had vassal princes who administered various provinces that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates (see Antiquities 7: 15: 4 and 8: 6: 1). This large Solomonic empire that extends in the Euphrates equates very well with the territorial claims of the 22nd dynasty of Pharaoh Sheshonq I as inscribed upon the Bubastite Gate at Karnak.
While the archaeology cannot support the claim of a ruling Israelite empire that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates [or from Judea to Israel], it most certainly does support the notion of a ruling Egyptian empire under Sheshonq I that encompassed all of these lands.
Solomon, Pharaoh of Egypt, Chapter VII: King Solomon, ps 155-156
Solomon imported horses from Egypt.
1 Kings 10: 28
= = = =
Ancient Records of Egypt (Wikipedia entry)
is a five-volume work by James Henry Breasted, published in 1906, in which the author has attempted to translate and publish all of the ancient written records of Egyptian history which had survived to the time of his work at the start of the twentieth century. (Breasted notes that his work covers only ancient “historical documents”, and generally does not include ancient Egyptian literature, religious writings, or texts on science, mathematics, or medicine.)[1]:xii
Volume I, The First to the Seventeenth Dynasties [1]
Volume II, The Eighteenth Dynasty [2]
Volume III, The Nineteenth Dynasty [3]
Volume IV, The Twentieth to the Twenty-Sixth Dynasties [4]
Volume V, Indices [5]
It was part of a proposed three-part set of translations of original texts by different authors, which at the time were difficult to find:
History of Egypt (five volumes)
History of Assyria (two volumes)
History of Mesopotamia
Only the first two collections — those from Egypt and Assyria — were published.
The David-Solomon United Kingdom is really Judea and Israel united under Psusennes II and Sheshonq I of Egypt.
1
The campaign lists which were inscribed in the Temple of Karnak by Sheshonq I [King Solomon] were mainly listing the military campaigns of his father, Psusennes II [King David].
2
Josephus expands on the reputed extent of Solomon’s empire by indicating that he had vassal princes who administered various provinces that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates (see Antiquities 7: 15: 4 and 8: 6: 1). This large Solomonic empire that extends in the Euphrates equates very well with the territorial claims of the 22nd dynasty of Pharaoh Sheshonq I as inscribed upon the Bubastite Gate at Karnak.
3
Solomon imported horses from Egypt.
1 Kings 10: 28
4
If Psusennes II and Sheshonq I were simply pseudoymns for David and Solomon or vice versa, would Sheshonq have created an equally stupendous temple as well? The answer is, Yes.
What Solomon’s Temple was for King Solomon, it was probably what the House of Millions of Years was for Sheshonq I.
“You have made my temple of millions of years of electrum (a naturally occurring alloy of gold and silver with trace amounts of copper and other metals). [You stand out] more than any king of them all.”
James Henry Breasted. Ancient Records of Egypt, Paragraph 357
5
Pharaoh Sheshonq had begun so many new constructions that he had to open up a new stone quarry.
Ibid., paragraph 704
Solomon did some quarrying also.
Solomon had 70,000 porters and 80,000 stonecutters
in the mountains
not including his 3300 foremen who supervised
the workers.
And the king commanded them to quarry large, costly stones
to lay the foundation of the temple with dressed stones.
1 Kings 5: 15-17
Archaeology cannot support the claim of a ruling Israelite empire that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates [or from Judea to Israel], it most certainly does support the notion of a ruling Egyptian empire under Sheshonq I that encompassed all of these lands.
pick up at p 159
I got to get that book. My impression is that Shoshenq did little more than raid. Very effective and violent raids, but raid none the less. And I am unaware of Shoshenk getting anywhere near the Euphrates, or even east of the Jordan.
I think all the archeology of the Amarna period fits those descriptions as well. The provincial governor as the Hittites retreated would have encompassed land nearly to the Euphrates, especially if you included the Amurru (Amorites) as brief allies. Especially the importance of horses in the battles between the Egyptian and Hittite forces, where the two man Egyptian chariots could easily pursue the Hittite 3 and 4 man chariots and inflict damage.
I like the comparisons of Psenunes to David, especially after reading that Psenunes was the high priest of Thebes and then took over as Pharaoh. this reminds me of the Psalm “You are a high priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek.” the time period is near that of David.
That Egyptians were in some scenes may mean a large Egyptian influence in the area during the Dt. historian’s time period. since he already stands accused of many anachronisms. I think this is simply another one of them.
I do not think we need to impose connections made between David and Solomon onto the people that inspired David and Solomon. Shoshenk does seem to have made the invasions, both by his own testimony and the Biblical mentions of Shishak. And Shoshenk did not extend to the Euphrates or anywhere near it.
I actually see more similarity between Solomon and Psenunes’s father Osarkon. He seemed to be quite the temple builder. And not just any temple. the Temple of Amun in Thebes.
Steefen said
The David-Solomon United Kingdom is really Judea and Israel united under Psusennes II and Sheshonq I of Egypt.1
The campaign lists which were inscribed in the Temple of Karnak by Sheshonq I [King Solomon] were mainly listing the military campaigns of his father, Psusennes II [King David].2
Josephus expands on the reputed extent of Solomon’s empire by indicating that he had vassal princes who administered various provinces that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates (see Antiquities 7: 15: 4 and 8: 6: 1). This large Solomonic empire that extends in the Euphrates equates very well with the territorial claims of the 22nd dynasty of Pharaoh Sheshonq I as inscribed upon the Bubastite Gate at Karnak.3
Solomon imported horses from Egypt.
1 Kings 10: 284
If Psusennes II and Sheshonq I were simply pseudoymns for David and Solomon or vice versa, would Sheshonq have created an equally stupendous temple as well? The answer is, Yes.What Solomon’s Temple was for King Solomon, it was probably what the House of Millions of Years was for Sheshonq I.
“You have made my temple of millions of years of electrum (a naturally occurring alloy of gold and silver with trace amounts of copper and other metals). [You stand out] more than any king of them all.”
James Henry Breasted. Ancient Records of Egypt, Paragraph 357
5
Pharaoh Sheshonq had begun so many new constructions that he had to open up a new stone quarry.
Ibid., paragraph 704Solomon did some quarrying also.
Solomon had 70,000 porters and 80,000 stonecutters
in the mountains
not including his 3300 foremen who supervised
the workers.
And the king commanded them to quarry large, costly stones
to lay the foundation of the temple with dressed stones.
1 Kings 5: 15-17Archaeology cannot support the claim of a ruling Israelite empire that extended from Egypt to the Euphrates [or from Judea to Israel], it most certainly does support the notion of a ruling Egyptian empire under Sheshonq I that encompassed all of these lands.
pick up at p 159
6
Sheshonq I had an architect/builder named Haramsaf/Hiramsaf.
Solomon had an architect/builder named Hiram/Huram/Huram Abi.
7
The Proverbs of Solomon come from the Egyptian text, The Instructions of Amen-emope
Proverbs 22: 17
Bow down thine ear and hear the words of the wise
and apply thine heart unto my knowledge
The Instructions of Amen-emope
Give your ears
Hear the sayings
Give your heart to understand them
Proverbs 22:20
Have not I written to thee 30 things in counsels and knowledge
That I might make thee know the certainty of the words of truth…
The Instructions of Amen-emope
Look to thee 30 chapters [which] inform [and] educate
They are the foremost of all books.
Pick up at Chapter 8: Sheshonq and Solomon, p. 183
FocusMyView said
Then we can simply drop the Euphrates as exaggeration then. That seems about right. Are there citations in the book for these astoundingly similar names in order to cross-reference them?
No, I would not drop the Euphrates as exaggeration. It is outside my scope of interest but when I read it, there was some substance to the claim.
I ordered from amazon Ancient Records of Egypt to get the citation in the bibliography of my book.
And the navy of Hiram that brought gold from Ophir
also brought in from Ophir great plenty of almug (algum) trees,
and precious stones.
And the king made of the almug trees pillars for the house of the Lord …
almug trees such as these have not been seen unto this day.
1 Kings 10: 11-12
EXPLANATION
Ophir had provided “David” and “Solomon” finely carved palm-frond pillars MADE FROM THE FINEST PINK GRANITE from Aswan. 21st Dynasty Temples in Tanis (not Jerusalem) had such pillars.
Pick up bottom of page 198
During the 21st and 22nd dynasties, there was looting of the New Kingdom tombs in the Valley of the Kings. The tomb robbing began at the very same time that Psusennes II (King David) and Sheshonq I (King Solomon), these pharaohs of Tanis, were in power. All of the burials in the Tanis necropolis contained grave goods THAT HAD BEEN PLUNDERED FROM THEBES.
King Solomon’s Mines were nothing more or less than the royal tombs of the New Kingdom pharaohs which could be found in the Valley of the Kings.
pick up at p. 205
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