My previous post was an interview with Sam Devis for his podcast “When Belief Dies.” Sam is an active volunteer on the blog and has an interesting background. I thought it would be interesting to have him write up an explanation of why he does this podcast, where it comes from, and how he personally relates to it. As you can no doubt guess, he is indeed one for whom belief has died.
Here is what he has to say:
Sam Devis: When Belief Dies
Bart has asked me to share a bit of my story in the hope that it casts a useful light on what I post on my blog, and why I started my podcast ‘When Belief Dies’. Essentially, I want to have honest conversations on faith, religion, and life.
It kind of seems ironic to me that I am going to do this, as I am not sure I know ‘who I am’ most of the time. I will do my best to tell my story well.
I was raised in a Christian family. I remember, with love, my father reading the children’s Bible to my two brothers and me on most evenings. He explained the Biblical narrative beautifully and with passion. I took that motif with me, throughout most of my school years – my parents’ impact on my belief was huge. My parent’s opinion on my doubt now carries with it a crippling worry. Rejection from the ones we love is the weapon we fear the most, whether that worry is justified or not.
I Rebelled
When I was in my teens, I rebelled against everything. I eventually realised I needed to commit to something and complete something after dropping out of a Nursing university course. So, with guidance from those with the highest value in my life, church, and family, I decided to go to Bible college.
I realised from an early age that if I wanted to really engage in this, I needed a mantra, a reason for being. So, I coined the phrase ‘Teaching God’s people His word.’ A reason and purpose for my life. Or so I thought.
I embarked upon my journey, with little thought on a world without faith in a personal God. I went through Bible college and did well. I learned a lot about myself in regard to academic ability, found a love of reading and writing (I am highly dyslexic), and started to work out and get into good shape.
When I left Bible college, I wanted to teach within a Church setting. Not in an entitled way, but rather in a passionate way. I had engaged with the Bible. I had put down some sort of roots and felt ready to encourage God’s people in their faith.
Bible College Sam Devis
Leaving Bible college, I got married and had to find work. Work which would have to be outside of the Church. I was gutted. The next six years are a bit of a blur. A mixture of working in Technology, and having two children. Straight after getting married I ended up having a couple of years battling with ‘purpose’. This resulted in a depression that took me out of work for a whole year.
I then found myself trying to rebuild my life, subsequently having to navigate living in faith and what that means in today’s world. I still suffer from depression but have managed to realise my triggers and know myself well enough now to be able to address them quickly. For me, I find release in things like walking, reading and talking. These really help me to overcome the dark moments – which I doubt will ever fully go away.
I Asked Questions – Where is God?
Anyway, through all this my church attendance fell and I began to ask a lot of questions. Where is God? I don’t ‘feel’ anything. Why am I here? I can’t see a reason. Are these dark moments planned? I had wanted to die. Have I ruined my marriage? She deserved better. What do I believe? I feel lost – like my ‘purpose’ was ash, and it was falling through my fingers.
You will be pleased to hear that my wife still loves me. She is the one I know will listen to what is going on in my head and pass no judgment. She will want me to engage with her, she will push me, and she will listen to my babbling, in the good and the bad.
My faith, however, got smashed to bits. I returned to church because they were and still ‘are’ in many aspects, my support network. I found myself, a man, wanting to believe in God. Wanting to live out my faith in a Christian setting but feeling like a fraud in every regard.
Sam Devis – On the Fringe of Christianity
About this time, I realised once again that I was on the fringe of Christianity. I needed to be in, or else I was going to fall out, and with that my whole world would collapse. I told the Elders of the church I was attending that I felt God had called me to ‘Teach God’s people His word’ – that I felt called to do that. They told me that they saw God’s hand in my life, and they would release me and my family to do that and join a church plant in Halifax, UK.
Surely – God would see me offering my everything to Him and make Himself known to me. Surely, I would find God and He would find me.
I remember praying, ‘Don’t leave me in my doubt, walk with me through this and bring me back to you. Restore me as you promised your world you would restore it back to you, throughout your Word’. I felt like a man lost in the wilderness, following a stream, trying to find its source. Surely God would reveal Himself to me. I ended up having a massive disk prolapse in my lower back and found that I was in vast amounts of pain and anger.
I wanted answers to suffering. I was and am completely aware that what I was going through then (and still am today) with my back is so minor compared to what some people experience.
I Prayed
I prayed. I sought. I cried. I pleaded. I felt nothing. I began to research human origins, trying to see the source of that stream I felt like I was walking by before. I read an incredible book called ‘Sapiens‘ by Yuval Noah Harari.
My mind was forever changed, as the framework I had seen everything through (the Judeo-Christian framework) broke. I was struck by how raw humanity’s origin is. The question that affected everything came back again. Could I really believe in a personal God like the Christian God? If I don’t, then I am to live ‘outside’ of God. But being completely honest, I wanted to live ‘within’ a God narrative.
I Just Didn’t Believe It
But then I realised that I didn’t believe it, even though I wanted to. I couldn’t force belief; forced belief isn’t belief, it’s lying. Sadly, I was weak. You see I realised that if my belief died, my world falls apart. So, I sought comfort in friends, mostly Christian. I read other books, Christian books, trying to ‘even the scales’. Smart people believe in God. My world used to sit within that framework. Surely someone can convince me that it is true again?!?
I dived in, and my home Church began to rebuild me. I stopped listening to the small voice in my head screaming in the background, ‘you don’t believe this.’ Why? Because if I gave in to it, I would lose my friends. My family would be horrified. My support network breaks apart. I am probably going to lose my job. My ‘purpose’ fails. My goals fail. My basis of morality stutters to a question mark without a God. The bottom of my life falls away without the ‘God’ pin holding it all together.
I shut the voice down. I ploughed ahead. My wife, our two children, and I moved to Halifax town to join that Church plant I mentioned before. We moved there to support them and show them the love of God. But all I will give them now is ash, and I don’t want to hurt them. What am I? Nothing but a faithless, lost, confused, ‘could have’.
Sam Devis: My Journey
When Belief Dies is my story and journey distilled down. The blog is an honest look at the whole journey, I publish one post each week and have a year and a half up there already. The podcast and YouTube Channel started out as a conversation between a close friend and me about why Christianity no longer makes sense. These days I am talking to people about why they believe or don’t.
I’ve spoken to the likes of Alister McGrath, Trent Horn, Matt Dillahunty, Graham Oppy, Justin Brierley, Bart Ehrman (obviously), and many others. I have a lot of conversations lined up as well.
I started When Belief Dies to help those, like me, who find themselves outside of the Christian narrative they called home, alone and confused. But this is a journey, and all are welcome, those of faith and those of none. I hope to see you over there soon 🙂
-Sam
To see where I am online, use this link: https://linktr.ee/whenbeliefdies
On reading your post I felt as if I was walking my own life again.
Biblical literalism is a killer, a knife in waiting. Waiting for those who sincerely believe, who WANT to believe, not only in God but also in the teachings of their church. In the leaders of their church. Who are only men, or women, teaching and doing what other men and women have taught them to believe and do. Dominoes.
Then like Neo in The Matrix the day comes when we first wake up and see the religious machine that has both sustained us and fooled us all at the same time. It is the spiritual sustenance we enjoyed and for some of us even craved but seeing the “real” world of our faith for the first time we become lost, disconnected, destroyed.
The important thing is to keep going. Keep journeying, keep reading and learning, keep moving forward. Sitting down, stopping, believing there is nothing more, that we have reached our destination is to stagnate. So we walk and keep walking both literally, as you enjoy doing, and also on our journey to seek understanding.
Thank you for this Linda, it’s been a strange and hard journey, but one that I have found immense value in day to day.
Thank you for sharing Sam. It is brave of you to be open with all these things. I can only imagine, but I know I can not see it as you walked it. I guess this is where acceptance between one another is so important. I’m not a Christian myself, but I believe in God. It’s kinda lonely for me, not fitting in. The hate and level of closed ears is devastating.
Words get small to what you wrote and somehow triggering to my own situation. However I appreciate the introduction and maybe you will show more of yourself. Whatever happens I wish you all the best for you and your family. I trust you to always be the best version of yourself.
Thank you.
Thank you for the comment, you should check out the blog or podcast if you want to hear more of my personal story or how I work through topics with guests. I hope you keep well and I will always attempt to be the best version of myself 🙂
Hi Sam,
Thank you for sharing that insight into your journey. It’s fascinating, and I am sure will chime with many on this blog.
I subscribed to your blog last week and will look forward to your weekly posts.
Best wishes, (from a fellow Brit) who knows what it’s like to be adrift.
Amazing to have you along for the journey, thank you 🙂
I was raised Roman Catholic but left the faith after my teenaged confirmation. As an atheist and agnostic I am still glad to live in a culture that affirms Judeo-Christian ethics.
I’m sure if I was raised in another ethical culture I would be glad that the people around me would affirm the prevalent ethical beliefs but I would still be me with my atheism and agnosticism.
I am glad that in the world among the many hypocrites there are many people who wish and sacrifice to make this a better world, who work and struggle to create that better world. I don’t believe I personally need to believe in a God for this to be true.
Thank you for your story. Having left Christianity myself a few years ago (I’m almost 61) I find reading about the experiences of others lends a mental support for me that it is okay to do so. I look forward to watching your videos on YouTube. I have never had the opportunity to tell anyone “my story” but in a nutshell if asked why I left the faith my response would be, education.
One of the reasons I started the blog and podcast was because I was scared of what people would think about me if they knew I no longer believed. I wanted to break through that fear, and maybe help others know they are not alone. Glad it helps in some small way 🙂
Thank you for allowing me to write this post for the blog Bart 🙌
I hope someone finds it helpful.
Thank you for your honesty and openness. We graduated from the same college.
I lost my faith while in Christian leadership and continued because I could not imagine life without the culture I was so enmeshed in. Eventually that imploded and I felt like a naked animal with no support network.
I still have a lot of respect for the teachings of Jesus and dream of a world where we would love our enemies and care for each other, I am an idealist, but not a realist.
I have been working through your podcasts and will continue to. Thank you for sharing your journey, I feel a little less lonely.
Delighted to have you on the journey! It’s amazing to find another person who went to the same college going through the same things. Makes me feel a little less alone as well 🙂
Enjoy the journey!
I’m a secular humanist. But I know how I got there and why it is satisfying to me doesn’t necessarily apply to other people’s situations. It’s an individual thing. For me, that’s part of the beauty of it – I get to be me (and that can be flexible).
Correct me if I am wrong, but this Easter in America was significant in that for the first time American Christians are in the minority. We are truly living off the smell of an empty vase when it come to Christianity. And we do see, still dimly (since 1900 anyhow) , what lies beyond.
I’m not sure that’s true. Here’s wikipedia In 2019, Christians represent 65% of the total adult population, 43% identifying as Protestants, 20% as Catholics, and 2% as Mormons. People with no formal religious identity at 26% of the total population. which I think tracks Pew.
I’ve heard a bunch of your podcasts. Top quality. Keep it up !
Thank you! I constantly wonder who listens and if they are making any difference. This is very encouraging – appreciate it 🙂
Hi Sam, thanks for sharing. As i read your post, there are strains in your story, that i have certainly experienced and probably many other people as well.. I sense some liberation in your writing, as i felt when i left the church. You mention in your story, “trying to live out a Christian faith but living as a fraud”. That is difficult. Obedience to God’s authority, who seems invisible most of the time,is arduous. Faith also requires loads of uncertainty. Hebrews 11; 1 states it well,” Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen”. I hoped for some things, but never got a conviction, like so many seems to possess or pretend to. What now Sam. You are left listening and reading and interviewing everyone and everything about the subject of our existence, and like myself, most of your literature is from non-believers. I am glad you remained open on the subject. I think it’s healthy. One thing I have learned from the Bible, more specifically from Jesus’s teachings, is that if somehow his dialogue was universally followed, we would no doubt have a better world. Timeless,effective principles.❤️
Great reflection here! I hope to read from most of the streams of thought on this stuff and will continue to talk to Christians about what they do and do not believe.
I am in talks with John C Lennox and N.T Wright to get them onto the podcast, which I know is a small viewpoint within the wide sweep of Christianity but are nonetheless massive names within their streams.
Take care 🙂
Thanks for a great post!
Becoming a victim of self-fulfilling rationalism and doctrinalism which really can affect and even diminish the inner notion of who we really are, our inner self, our inner dimensions, and perhaps a unity that the (some) ancients claim. In my mind, both rationalism and doctrinalism deprive us of our own qualities that I suspect lie in our essential being and trap us / guide us to expect to receive everything, inspiration, development, and if you like, any kind of ecstatic/joyous feelings, from outside.
Perhaps it all began from within.
No wonder we lose our grip!
Amen 😉
Thank you for sharing this, Sam. Your thoughts made me think of the old “translation of pistis” discussion and that “belief” tends to have such a propositional/brain/cognitive feel in English. And also the discussion that Christianity tends to be more focused on “beliefs” than other religions, (e.g. reciting creeds)..
I look at the history of Christianity as an ongoing conversation between people with personal spiritual/supernatural experiences/feelings, theologians, pastors, and representatives of religious institutions. It sounds as if possibly you have not had direct personal spiritual/supernatural experiences/feelings? Or did these not match Christian theologies?
Thank you for this, I would encourage you to continue with my podcast and blog, I explore spirituality at length in the near future on both.
Thanks, Sam, I was hoping that we could discuss my question here.
Yes, I found your podcast through this blog and it has helped to know there are others out there struggling with faith and religion as much as I am. Your gentle personality comes across during your podcast. It is much appreciated and a welcome surprise. Thank you.
I haven’t listened to all your shows, so I might be wrong on this, but ones I have listened to usually deal with the validity of a judeo-christian centric god based on a greco-roman worldview. I understand that that is all most westerners know (including myself) but, I just wish that our discussions on religion, faith and the existence of a god didn’t leave out the worldviews of non-westerners who make up more than half of the human race. Views from the two most populous nations on earth by a lot (China and India) barely get a mention (this is not just on your podcast, btw). I mean, we are talking about a god of all humanity so, a little more inclusion would be nice.
Anyways, just thought I’d share my two cents. Keep up the awesome work. I only wish I had half the courage (and temperament) to do what you are doing.
Thank you for this Walter! I have been trying to find those other voices to have them onto the show. Maybe you can navigate to my website and use the ‘contact’ link to suggest some places I can look to explore these areas further. Thank you in advance!
Excellent and heartfelt reflection
TY 🙂
Thank you so much for sharing your story with us, Sam. After finishing my junior year of Bible college last year, I began to lose my faith in the summer when confronting the Bible’s contradictions and discrepancies along with the problem of evil. I’m still dealing with a lot of mental anguish and depression, and knowing that I’m not alone on this journey really helps. I could really relate when you spoke about your close relationship with your wife. I got married just last May, and when I was dealing with suicidal thoughts months ago, my wife was sometimes the only reason I decided to keep going. Thank you so much for being transparent. I’ve already subscribed to your YouTube page and your podcast. So, I look forward to following your journey and learning with you.
Thank you for following my story Partick. I am so sorry to hear about your struggles, but delighted to hear that you know you are not alone!
This life feels like it is best lived with others, and it sounds like you’ve found someone worth living it with.
Continue to be honest in who you are and what you believe. As I often say on the podcast, if God is real, He will reveal Himself. All we can do is look, listen and learn.
My wife is from childhood a christian. She really has never known anything else. Which is a wonder to me why she married me since day one she has know that I am an agnostic. I play my part for her because I know this is her life line. What gets me through a Sunday school and worship is my mantra (if I can call it that) “if you are taught wrong you will teach wrong”. I was brought up in a strong Roman Catholis back ground to say the least it did not take.
A question for Bart, please. This is a general question not linked specifically to any particular post, so hopefully, that is okay. I heard discussions recently about Joshua Swamidass who seems to be from a scientific background and is giving credence to the idea that mankind could be descended from one pair of humans. I have no scientific training but when I hear something like this it throws me a bit – it has taken me time to let go of the guilt of leaving Adam and Eve behind as my church used to teach one must accept they are real. Can you shine any light on this “new” science, please?
No, it’s bogus I’m afraid. You might be interested in reading the first parts of Noah Harari’s book Sapiens.
The first thing a person must do is be true to their own understanding. Yet if we are honest, we realize that our thought is often ill-informed, or incomplete, and so effectively wrong. While scripture tells us in many places that we will find God when we seek Him with our whole heart (Fx; Jeremiah 29:13, Matthew 7:7-8), it also infers that we are unable to do so by an act of will (Fx; John 14:6). What a paradox, to say the least!
I read Harari’s book “Sapiens” summer of 2019, and found it a fascinating and wide-ranging conglomeration of anthropology, economics, sociology, and history. In no way did it shatter my belief in the *something* which I have experienced as the living spirit, God. What it did do was to illustrate and reinforce what we already know – that the most malleable material in the universe may very well be the human mind.
Thank you, Mr. Devis, for sharing your experiences. Thank you, Dr. Ehrman for your deep dive into historical accuracy, and the well-founded context in which it helps place my own Christian experience. For those seeking Truth, there is no finish line.
Thank you Sam. I have often wondered when we walk away from what we believe… that we are walking away from the only picture we were given of God. Is that the only picture out there? … the only explanation viable in today’s world? Just because we need to walk away from that God, does that journey end in a bottomless pit? I would hope not. I would hope that there is something to walk in to… something more meaningful for us… something that can embrace all the goodness and beauty we still have in this world. Because even amid all the pain, heartache, confusion, control, deception, craziness… there is still goodness and beauty. I don’t want to let go of that.
For me… the slide started when I read Dr. Peter Enns. Why does it take a PHD in Biblical Scholarship to know this stuff? Where were they when I went to Bible School? I just had Lutheran pastors feed me doctrine back then.
Bart… do you know Peter Enns? Have you crossed paths with him? https://peteenns.com/
Thank you for sharing your story Sam.
I am reminded of the song “Sunrise After Tilling”, by a duo of Australian Christian musicians.
“The faith that has sustained me, comforted and soothed me
Now hangs like a cross of wood around my neck.
What am I learning, feeling? Where’s the idealism
That drew me to this place of barrenness?
Where is the new beginning, the sunrise after tilling?
Where are the shoots of green growing through the soil?”
Listen here: https://johncoleman.bandcamp.com/track/sunrise-over-tilling (for some reason mistitled “Sunrise Over Tilling” on the Bandcamp page).