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Multiple Space Jesuses: What's the Problem?
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Stephen
4545 Posts
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May 4, 2026 - 12:23 pm

Anton does his usual dependable job in explaining stuff. 

What makes me angry is that a perfectly fascinating scientific inquiry was turned into a clickbaity, goofball, sh*tshow.  Now that the genuine science papers are coming out the YouTube Goobers have already moved on to the next kerfuffle.  

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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May 4, 2026 - 2:50 pm

2380 said
Unless you Grok Mystery Science 3000 you shouldn’t be talking about space aliens .
  

What? 
Give us an example.

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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June 12, 2026 - 3:02 pm

Steefen:
Update on proving @Stephen wrong.
Video is posted by Reuters.

re: non-human sentient beings

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Steefen
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June 12, 2026 - 3:11 pm

So, there hasn’t been evidence only due to national security.

The case is being made: Okay, we accept that, but the existence of non-human biologics is not a matter of national security and that is what Stephen says does not exist: non-human biologics (aliens) do not exist.

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Stephen
4545 Posts
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June 12, 2026 - 4:30 pm

This might be an odd spot for a movie review but it’s because of the subject. 

Here is the YouTube’s trailer for Steven Spielberg’s new movie, ** you do not have permission to see this link **.  I unexpectedly got an invite yesterday on opening day and saw it.   I think most people can figure what it’s about.  Nevertheless my comments will contain no overt narrative spoilers of anything not pretty obvious from the trailer.  I will discuss some of the ideas raised by the movie and since some people do like to get their art unmediated this will serve as your SPOILER ALERT.  

First of all, if you’re already a big Spielberg fan you’ll enjoy it. He is a technical genius and a master editor.  Spielberg still has the same itches to scratch: no matter how smart you are you don’t understand a thing until you feel a thing.  I was happy that the movie is character driven rather than a CGI epic.  That said, as you would expect the film looks beautiful.  And a nice atmospheric John Williams soundtrack.  All the actors are terrific, especially Emily Blunt.  Colin Firth makes a great villain. 

I do have a couple film-type criticisms but they’re the same issues I have with all Spielberg’s films so beside the point.  I’m more concerned here with the liabilities of the concept.  The fundamental paradigm that is being presented without question. 

Everyone knows it already.  At some point the human race was contacted by aliens.  Dark Forces are hiding the truth and exploiting what knowledge they gather for nefarious purposes.  Courageous former insiders are trying to reveal the truth to an unseeing public. 

I don’t believe in the Conspiracy Theory of history simply because if you actually look at history it’s an unplanned mess – a mass of ineptitude.  What pack of humans who ever lived has had the discipline to conduct a successful long term conspiracy?  What humans can be counted on to do is act in their own interest.  And at times that interest is best served by spilling the beans.  If somebody other than Oswald really had shot Kennedy don’t you think they would have been on Oprah decades ago?  

What does the Good Book say?  For there is nothing hidden that will not be disclosed, and nothing concealed that will not be known and brought to light.  –Luke 8:17   Amen!

But that’s not the major problem.  I’ve discussed this before but I am nothing if not perseverative. (Look it up. Look it up. Look it up.) 

The scenario being offered us is inherently incoherent. 

We still have questions of course but we have explored our own Solar System well enough to be able to determine that we do not share it with another spacefaring civilization. Any “aliens” who visit will come from another star in a different solar system lightyears away.    

To perform interstellar travel these aliens would be centuries, if not thousands of years ahead of us technologically.   (Consider what it would require of a civilization to accomplish reliable interstellar travel.  Remember, these aliens are depicted as routinely visiting our planet over decades.)  As impressive as interplanetary travel is to think about, interstellar travel is orders of magnitude more difficult. We can make some assumptions about the aliens simply from the fact that they accomplished such a feat.

1. They will have solved the energy problem.  Such journeys require a dependable, efficient, manageable, almost limitless fuel supply and supporting tech.

2. They will have solved the social problem.   Crumbling, anarchistic societies don’t build starships.  This kind of tech presupposes a strong, stable, thriving, long-lasting social order be in place.   

One problem for the scenario is that if these two assumptions are granted, then it removes 99.99999% of all the motivations applied to the aliens in the first place by the Conspiracy Theorists.   Some conclusions follow:

A. They would need nothing from us.

B. They would have nothing to fear from us.

If they wished to remain undetected we would never know they were here.  If they wished to land in public they could do so unmolested, with impunity. 

Yet how are they depicted in this unquestioned scenario?

They are both omnipotent and hapless.  They can travel lightyears across space successfully but they can’t pilot a flying saucer without crashing all over the place.  (There have been as many recovered bodies at crash sites at this point as there were chapels in the Middle Ages that contained pieces of the True Cross.)  They come all this way to scare the living crap out of kids and draw crop circles!   They have some quixotic interest in earthly politics.   

Isn’t it clear that this view of alien contact is simply a projection of our own fears and desires? 

Of course that’s what art is.  I was always told that when I described a problem I should be ready to offer a solution. So let’s interrogate the scenario artistically, ok?

1. Make a movie about a secret government group whose job it is to suppress this information about aliens because the truth is so horrible that if it did come out it really would drive humans insane.   Take the point of view of the Colin Firth character in Spielberg’s movie.  A Lovecraftian reversal.  The truth doesn’t save – it destroys.

2. Explore the idea of what actually seems to have been the case. Namely that even if the govt didn’t invent the UFO phenomenon whole-cloth they used it as a disinformation screen to deflect interest in Cold War secret projects.  

3. Explore how people really would react to the announcement of alien contact.  In other words start where Spielberg’s film ends.  With First Contact.  The film hints at various possible responses from worship to utter fear but has unyielding faith in human nature.  That old classic from 1951, ** you do not have permission to see this link **, is more on the mark.  The alien visitor is shot within minutes of landing.  He encounters hope and vision but also fear and suspicions. 

First Contact is a major subcategory of science fiction.  It explores the initial moment of contact and the resulting social & cultural & personal existential shock of discovering we are not alone.  My favorite account is from Arthur Clarke’s 1953 novel ** you do not have permission to see this link **.  Clarke’s aliens announce themselves just as earthlings are about to journey to space.  They demonstrate their benevolence by stopping all ongoing wars and introducing technology into human society that benefits all.  But they don’t physically reveal themselves at first for reasons that are explained later in the novel.  They know from past encounters that people need prep time. It lessens the shock when people are already used to your presence.  (Of course the aliens have their own agenda.  Read the book. One of my favorites.)  

Option #3 could be a good movie, properly handled.  Various people confront the revelation of aliens with various responses.  Keep it on the human level.  No special effects extravaganzas.   Drama.  You could even use the same cast as Spielberg!    

ps Of course there is also the other side.  Make a movie where people determine somehow that we really are alone in the universe.  Just us.  Contact that. Identify with that

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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June 12, 2026 - 4:35 pm

A review of a fictional movie, not even a documentary, is inferior in quality as a counter argument to nonfictional realities (the press conference and the discussion in the press conference).

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Stephen
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June 12, 2026 - 4:41 pm

Steefen said
A review of a fictional movie, not even a documentary, is inferior in quality as a counter argument to nonfictional realities (the press conference and the discussion in the press conference).
  

That press conference was a movie tie-in.  Spielberg is very powerful.  Head of the illuminati.  Hmmm…maybe I shouldn’t have said that outloud. 

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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408
June 12, 2026 - 10:40 pm

Stephen said

Steefen said
A review of a fictional movie, not even a documentary, is inferior in quality as a counter argument to nonfictional realities (the press conference and the discussion in the press conference).
  

That press conference was a movie tie-in.  Spielberg is very powerful.  Head of the illuminati.  Hmmm…maybe I shouldn’t have said that outloud. 
  

Conspiracy theory as a defense. ROFL.

It’s not a good movie.

Get on topic: the subject matter of the press conference–not some movie.

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BJH1960

1188 Posts
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409
June 13, 2026 - 3:04 am

If somebody other than Oswald really had shot Kennedy don’t you think they would have been on Oprah decades ago?  

It was! But the video was redacted. 

The scenario being offered us is inherently incoherent. 

Indeed, for all the reasons you list.

Isn’t it clear that this view of alien contact is simply a projection of our own fears and desires?

Of course that’s what art is.

What’s the time frame for the beginning of stories of alien contact? Is it safe to say they are largely the product of Cold War America? If so, isn’t it telling the drivel they produced?  Others wrote ** you do not have permission to see this link **

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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410
June 13, 2026 - 1:49 pm

Stephen
That press conference was a movie tie-in. Spielberg is very powerful. Head of the illuminati.

Steefen
Who is the head of the Illuminati?
They went after Chris Bledsoe?

dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.yz3ZciA-m2kqkH6T1W27pIieQMttl7DMV0cpJ5vujgMZhnUWVJ5IdF2E2a4qaI2RS2yTcShhg_o7BBHRQbGyN5NVQtlOydkgNwnzyGkysUSaJf9u-1USYq79pTmFEpiA_GiQRM8jIjcLFx4baSylBGC5ktzsYaoAr_gMQCwyR_y3nn1650vuHk1HhDoCShbi17VIcdtuvTcivT2PkPCnNusdGddh7CxdTyrtpkDU__4.smt7FxO4bmdbYXQRQh1rnW6wwv-iUOEHA650OiMWOHU&dib_tag=se&keywords=UFO%2Bof%2BGod&qid=1781367107&sprefix=ufo%2Bof%2Bgod%2Caps%2C174&sr=8-1

4,653 Amazon Ratings averaging 4.6 stars

 

 

1.4 million views, 46,000 Thumbs up.

 

Lockheed Martin looked at the alien UFO technology.

The Anunnaki genetically engineered humans and the Bible in the book of Genesis blamed it on Eve and Paul and St. Augustine called it original sin–when it was Enki who gave Adam & Eve knowledge, disagreement between Enlil and Enki, not the Fall of Man.

Stephen, your counter argument is the Illuminati.

ROFL

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Stephen
4545 Posts
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411
June 13, 2026 - 2:10 pm

Lockheed Martin looked at the alien UFO technology.

The Anunnaki genetically engineered humans and the Bible in the book of Genesis blamed it on Eve and Paul and St. Augustine called it original sin–when it was Enki who gave Adam & Eve knowledge, disagreement between Enlil and Enki, not the Fall of Man.

Stephen, your counter argument is the Illuminati.

ROFL

And to think, Steefen, for a long time I didn’t think you had any sense of humor.

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Stephen
4545 Posts
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412
June 13, 2026 - 2:31 pm

What’s the time frame for the beginning of stories of alien contact? Is it safe to say they are largely the product of Cold War America? If so, isn’t it telling the drivel they produced? Others wrote A Hard Rain’s A-Gonna Fall.

People have always seen strange things in the skies but the modern UFO movement is largely a product of post-WWII atomic age anxiety and Cold War paranoia.  The “official” inauguration was Kenneth Arnold’s infamous 1947 sighting of what he called “flying disks”, which quickly morphed into “flying saucers” in the press.

The creepy “abductee” movement began in 1961 with the incident involving Betty & Barney Hill.  It didn’t really get going hard & heavy though until the 80s with Brad Steiger’s stupid books.

Useful to remember that the Hill’s “experience” came to light through “recovered memories” during hypnosis.  Procedures that caused such a clusterf*ck during the so-called Satanic Panic of the 90s. 

I’m also informed that the preferred term now is “experiencer”  rather than “abductee”. Certainly don’t want to trigger the Space Brothers! 

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BJH1960

1188 Posts
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413
June 13, 2026 - 3:41 pm

I’d not heard of Brad Steiger before but did a little reading on his books. Stupid seems like a great way of describing them. 

I’m rather amused at how certain terms are no longer considered appropriate. Use the old ones, and you’re bound to get yourself in a heap of trouble. People do find themselves getting worked up about the silliest things. 

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Judith

873 Posts
(Online)
414
June 13, 2026 - 8:43 pm

Virtuous for a young woman; wholesome for a young man.

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Steefen
7708 Posts
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415
June 13, 2026 - 10:30 pm

Stephen, your counter argument is the Illuminati.

ROFL

Stephen
And to think, Steefen, for a long time I didn’t think you had any sense of humor.

Steefen:
This is still a serious thread.

I’m picking up at 2 hours 26 minutes of 3 hrs 15 minutes of the NASA video to complete watching it.

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BJH1960

1188 Posts
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416
June 14, 2026 - 12:52 am

That press conference was a movie tie-in. Spielberg is very powerful. Head of the illuminati. Hmmm…maybe I shouldn’t have said that outloud.

Especially not on a serious thread, which, thankfully, you started.

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BJH1960

1188 Posts
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417
June 14, 2026 - 1:10 am

In seeing if I could find anything about the move from abductee to experiencer, I came across ** you do not have permission to see this link ** which does nothing to answer my question but talks about the psychology of those who claim to have had alien contact. 

Full Disclosure: It is an article by people who are actually university educated in what they are writing about.  It is not a video produced by a crackpot.

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2380

58 Posts
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418
June 14, 2026 - 8:48 am

Make aliens great again!

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BJH1960

1188 Posts
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419
June 14, 2026 - 9:20 am

Very nice.

That works on so many different levels.

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Stephen
4545 Posts
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420
June 14, 2026 - 10:44 am

Steefen:
This is still a serious thread.

I appreciate that. 

The original purpose in creating the thread was to discuss the implications of aliens on human culture, especially religion.  Not to spread fanciful conspiracy theories. My discussion of the new Spielberg film falls well within the intended subject area.  But I am magnanimous.  The only thing that’ll definitely get you cancelled here is if you bring up the Shroud of Turin.  

Actually the religious aspects of the film are one of its weaknesses I thought. The movie gives us glimpses but doesn’t really examine it.  There is liberal use of religious imagery but of course the film is not a documentary. Right now I’m paying attention to some of the responses to the movie from both religious folks and UFO folks.  Very interesting.

I can see where the term “abductee” might be problematic to those who assume the Aliens must be benign.

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