Robert
Bart sees the view of Jesus as a divine pre-existent being and Jesus being raised from the dead as being a pre-Pauline view.

Steefen
Tell us who had this view of the biblical Jesus before Paul. It certainly was not the disciples.

Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary – A. Webb Roberts Library, Fort Worth, TX

817-923-1921 x2740

Dallas Theological Seminary, Tupin Library

214-887-5280

I’m looking for a book on how well Paul picks up the sayings of Jesus.
Instead of going through a concordance for every red-letter verse of Jesus in the gospels and looking for cross-references to Pauline letters, I’m hoping there is a book, books, articles that do that.

Thank you,
I’m leaving my phone number but also my email so you can email the results of your findings.

Stephen
None of this is in any way incompatible with a historical Jesus.

Steefen
Don’t you have a problem with reincarnation
let alone angel to human incarnation rather than human to human incarnation?

A historical person is a unique biological human being.

Steefen, Argumentation Specialist

That unique biological human being may be a new human being or a reincarnation of a prior human being but not an incarnation or reincarnation of an angel.

That unique biological human being may be

1) a new human being

2) a reincarnation of a prior human being

3) an incarnation or reincarnation of angel

4) an incarnation or reincarnation of a god.

I am controlling scope creep by limited historical persons to #1 and #2. What? Patton said, in the biographical movie Patton, that he felt he was reincarnated?

I disagree with Stephen that #3 and possibly #4 are no longer myth and euhemerism but can be historical personages.

Tupin Library got back to me, having found two books that should provide more of the information I seek:

First Recommendation:

Victor Paul Furnish is University Distinguished Professor of New Testament, Emeritus at Perkins School of Theology, Southern Methodist University, and general editor of the Abingdon New Testament Commentaries.

His book is Jesus according to Paul.
I will look at
   Chapter 3: Sayings of Jesus in Paul’s Letters and
   Chapter 4: Jesus in Paul’s Gospel.

Second Recommendation

David Wenham is lecturer in New Testament at Wycliffe Hall, Oxford, England, and is on the Faculty of Theology of Oxford University. He is also the author of The Rediscovery of Jesus’ Eschatological Discourse and The Parables of Jesus

His book is Paul: Follower of Jesus or Founder of Christianity?
I will look at
   Chapter 1: Introducing the Question, Section 3: Solving the Jesus-Paul Question: Can It Be Done?
   Chapter 2: The Kingdom of God, Part 2: Connecting Jesus and Paul
   Chapter 3: Who Is Jesus? Part 1: Comparing Jesus and Paul and Part 2: Connecting Jesus and Paul

This book goes on to its Chapter 9.

Bart
There are several other instances in which Paul indicates that he is echoing a “word” or “commandment of the Lord.”  This happens in his earliest letter, 1 Thessalonians, where he is discussing the future return of Jesus from heaven, when all the dead will be raised and all living believers will join them in a heavenly reunion with the Lord (** you do not have permission to see this link **).  In this context Paul states “For this we say to you by a word of the Lord, that we who are living who are left until the coming of the Lord will certainly not precede those who are asleep.  For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with the voice of an archangel and with the trumpet of God; and the dead in Christ will rise first….”    For Paul, those who had already died would meet the Lord first, to be immediately followed by those who had not yet died.  And he learned this from a “word of the Lord.”

As indicated earlier, the mythicist G. A. Wells argues that the sayings of Jesus in Paul’s writings were given to him not from the traditions about the teachings of the historical Jesus, but from “prophecies” delivered in Paul’s churches, direct revelations from the Lord of heaven.   In some instances that may indeed have been the case, and this passage in 1 Thessalonians may be one instance of it.  The reason for thinking so is that we do not have any record of the historical Jesus saying any such thing about what would happen at his return (though see ** you do not have permission to see this link **).  So there are two choices here: either  Paul knew of a tradition in which the historical Jesus  allegedly did discuss this matter, or he has learned this teaching through a prophecy in one of his churches.

Steefen
“The future return of Jesus from heaven, when all the dead will be raised and all living believers will join them in a heavenly reunion”

As mentioned earlier, I cannot use this. For example, Matthew 24: 31 does not have a cross reference with Mark, Luke, or John.

Paul, 1 Corinthians 10: 27 On eating the food of unbelievers
If an unbeliever invites you to a meal and you want to go, eat anything set before you without raising questions of conscience. 

Jesus, Matthew 15: 11 and Mark 7: 15 (Possible Application: On eating the food of unbelievers)
A man is not defiled by what enters his mouth, but by what comes out of it.”
There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

= = =

Sometimes Paul does say he is quoting the Lord, who is giving instruction.
This shows that while Paul is week on biographical details of Jesus, he is aware of some sayings.
Therefore, Paul IS referencing a third person. Paul is not 100% Jesus.

While reading Richard Carrier (On the Historicity of Jesus) I see this conclusion. There was a Mystery Cult of Cephas that Paul persecuted. Then Paul started his own Mystery Cult.

Step 1: The Archangel
Step 2: The Archangel Mystery Cult
Step 3: The Archangel Mystery Cult of Paul
Step 4: Post Jewish Revolt euhemerism of the Archangel

Challenges: 
Was John the Baptist involved with an Archangel Mystery Cult?
One cannot get to a mystery cult of Cephas without the former disciples of John the Baptist, no?