#1 The gospel of John is not factual. In this gospel there is a resurrection of Lazarus that does not appear in the synoptic gospels.
Second, so, at John 1: 10 when it says, He was in the world which was made through him, that is quite unreliable.
Only the Son has seen God.
Was that with regular vision or XRay vision like the Chandra telescope?
Is it dimensions 5 through 11?
John 1:29
Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world.
John 1:49
Nathaniel said the Teacher is the Son of God and the king of Israel [not Judea].
God hides behind the Sun from our perspective here on Earth. If any telescope did point itself to behind the Sun from our perspective here on Earth; it’s not going to see much besides who knows, blurry picture and damaged parts. That’s the best theory I’ve thought of so far on why nobody can see God. Man hides behind unfalsifiable scientific ideas because man wants to know things. See means to know. The eyes and see are an idiom for knowledge.
What are you asking or suggesting?
If scientists have created the Son as a telescope? (John 6:46)
Doctors will create medicine so that we never die? (John 1:29)
The telescope will be the King of Israel and teach the doctors? (John 1:49)
If something existed before Abraham? (John 8:48)
“prove there is interaction within the Trinity”
An “us” was involved in the creation of humans,
and an “us” was involved in making “one people speaking the same language” start speaking different languages.
Genesis 1:26 (NIV)
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Then God said,
“Let us make mankind
in our image,
in our likeness,
so that they may rule over the fish in the sea
and the birds in the sky,
over the livestock
and all the wild animals,
and over all the creatures that move along the ground.”
Genesis 11 (NIV)
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5 But the Lord came down to see the city and the tower the people were building.
6 The Lord said,
“If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this,
then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them.
7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”
8 So the Lord scattered them from there over all the earth,
and they stopped building the city.
9 That is why it was called Babel— because there the Lord confused the language of the whole world.
From there the Lord scattered them over the face of the whole earth.
An “us” was involved in banishing humans from the Garden of Eden.
An “us” was involved in sending Isaiah.
Genesis 3 (NIV)
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22 And the Lord God said,
“The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil.
He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever.”
23 So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken.
24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.
Isaiah 6 (NIV)
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8 Then I heard the voice of the Lord saying,
“Whom shall I send?
And who will go for us?”
And I said, “Here am I. Send me!”
9 He said, “Go and tell this people:
“‘Be ever hearing, but never understanding;
be ever seeing, but never perceiving.’
“Our minds can take precedence over physical laws and are therefore nonphysical”
“How do you know your mind isn’t constrained by physical laws?”
I’m unaware of any physical laws that constrain my mind.
Are you aware of any such physical laws?
I think the rather more apposite question is Are you aware of any physical laws that your mind violates?
After all, you did begin by asserting that “our minds can take precedence over physical laws”; so which laws did you have in mind?
“Are you aware of any physical laws that your mind violates?”
No.
“did begin by asserting that ‘our minds can take precedence over physical laws’; so which laws did you have in mind?”
My mind can make my hand rise, despite gravity’s downward pull.
My mind can have my foot kick an object at rest, and make that object move.
My mind can have my hands construct a device that turns a collection of gas particles into a liquid.
“Does Old Faithful have a nonphysical mind, given that it can shoot water into the air despite gravity’s pull?”
I’m unaware of Old Faithful having any mind.
“deer can jump. Do you think they have nonphysical minds?”
I don’t know.
A deer has a brain. A deer makes decisions. Do you think a deer has a mind?
Do you think the human mind is:
“nonphysical”?
physical?
My mind can have my hand pick up “a book lying on a table.”
My mind can have my foot hit the brakes on a traveling car, stopping the car.
Human minds can construct a rocket that lifts into space, overcoming the earth’s gravitational pull.
Newton’s Laws of Motion
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1. First Law
Statement: “An object at rest remains at rest, and object in motion remains at a constant speed and in a straight line unless acted upon by an unbalanced force”.
According to the first law, an object cannot start, stop, or change direction all by itself.
In order to cause an action, it will require force.
Consider the case where the object is at rest. It is because either no forces act on it or all the external forces cancel each other. It will remain at rest unless an unbalanced force displaces it.
Example: A book lying on a table.
Consider the case where the object is moving at a constant speed in a straight line. It will continue to move with the same speed and remain in a straight line as long as no external force acts on it. If there is an external force, the object will either change its direction, accelerate or decelerate, or come to a stop.
Example 1: A car moving on a road at a constant speed comes to a stop when the brakes are applied.
Here, the action of applying brakes is the force responsible for stopping the car.
…
3. Third Law
Statement: “If one object exerts a force on another object, then the other object exerts an equal and opposite force on the first object”.
According to the third law, for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.
…
Example 1: The thrust of a rocket produces the force required to lift the rocket from Earth.
Here, the thrust is the action, and the lift of the rocket is the reaction.
Colin, the statement was some things can be seen with the human eye.
The James Webb Space Telescope is a space telescope designed to conduct infrared astronomy.
So, we can see more of the universe not only because the JWST is large than Hubble but it can conduct infrared astronomy.
Is God an infrared object?
“Are you aware of any physical laws that your mind violates?”
No.
If your mind follows the same physical laws as everything else, why do you think it must be nonphysical?
If something like telekinesis were real, I’d see the argument. But when we design a rocket to escape Earth’s gravity or when we lift our arms, we are using the laws of physics, not defying them–just like birds use aerodynamic forces to overcome the force of gravity. The fact that birds fly, and deer jump, and geysers shoot water into the air doesn’t bespeak some nonphysical entity that lets them defy the laws that govern physical bodies because they aren’t actually defying the laws of physics, and by the same token neither does the bare fact that I can lift my hand.
We are a long way from understanding the internal working of the human brain, but so far we haven’t found any places where it isn’t following the same laws that govern the rest of the the material world.
“We are not here to waste time”
I am here to have fun, which happens to also involve spending a lot of time.
Some consider that a waste of time.
“Reread the first line of Response 101”
“#1 The gospel of John is not factual.
In this gospel there is a resurrection of Lazarus that does not appear in the synoptic gospels.
Second, so, at John 1: 10 when it says, He was in the world which was made through him, that is quite unreliable”
Suppose 2 journalists write up and publish in their respective newspapers accounts of a particular incident, and journalist Andy mentions a detail that journalist Brian doesn’t mention at all.
Can we thereby conclude that:
the detail is erroneous?
Andy’s account “is not factual”?
Suppose 2 historians write up and publish biographies about George, and
Charles mentions an incident that Daniel doesn’t mention at all.
Can we thereby conclude that the:
incident never happened?
account by Charles “is not factual”?
“Let us make man is not the Trinity”
How would you characterize the “us”?
“If your mind follows the same physical laws as everything else, why do you think it must be nonphysical?”
I’ll do some reading, and maybe get back to this.
“If something like telekinesis were real, I’d see the argument.
But when we design a rocket to escape Earth’s gravity or when we lift our arms, we are using the laws of physics, not defying them–just like birds use aerodynamic forces to overcome the force of gravity.
The fact that birds fly, and deer jump, and geysers shoot water into the air doesn’t bespeak some nonphysical entity that lets them defy the laws that govern physical bodies because they aren’t actually defying the laws of physics, and by the same token neither does the bare fact that I can lift my hand.
We are a long way from understanding the internal working of the human brain, but so far we haven’t found any places where it isn’t following the same laws that govern the rest of the the material world.”
While “we are a long way from understanding the internal working of the human brain,” do we at least know how matter could have given rise to the human mind?
While “we are a long way from understanding the internal working of the human brain,” do we at least know how matter could have given rise to the human mind?
How could we explain how the human mind came about if we don’t actually understand the human mind itself?
We don’t know the goal so of course we can’t specify how to get to it.
God hides behind the Sun from our perspective here on Earth. If any telescope did point itself to behind the Sun from our perspective here on Earth; it’s not going to see much besides who knows, blurry picture and damaged parts. That’s the best theory I’ve thought of so far on why nobody can see God.
Back in elementary school (or whatever they call it now) we were asked to draw with watercolors and my friend Jeffrey produced a picture of heaven which he thought was on the dark side of the Moon. There was God’s throne surrounded by two angels. I thought the picture was beautiful but he wouldn’t let me have it. Odd that I still remember that after all these years.
Are you aware of any physical laws that your mind violates?
This is such a monstrous straight line that I am paralyzed and unable to respond.
So following the conventional god-of-the-gaps thought process, the entire multiverse could be the creation of a single human mind. But whose?
Robert, did you say something to me?
BDEhrman
FreedomBen
evgendob
Robert
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